Swistle: Baby Names

Name Updates!

2012-01-29T20:04:00.002-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy or Girl B_____ss, Sibling to Owen Albert!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl or Boy McD____, Sibling to Ronan!

Baby Boy Doorahzio: Italian Names

2012-01-29T06:17:00.004-06:00

Carly writes:

We are due with our first baby, a boy, in April and my husband and I are having trouble finding a name.

To give some background information, I'm Irish and my husband is Italian, 1st generation. I've always been a fan of ethnic names so I'd like to find something Italian to match our very Italian last name pronounced door-ahz-io.

We were all set with girls name options (Luciana, Viviana, Valentina) with middle name Willa in honor of my lost little brother Ryan William. Our middle name for our son will be Ryan, even though it doesn't "match" with any of the Italian-ness going on.

Our names are Matthew and Carly and we have two dogs, Sugar and Gus, and a cat, Jasper. We do hope to have more children in the future.

After going through some extensive exercises of writing top 5 lists and comparing and then comparing some more, we've each narrowed our favorites down to 1. (Well I have 2, whoops!)

· My husbands favorite is Marcello (pronounced mar-chel-lo), and while I don't hate it, I also don't love it. We've discussed nicknames and none stand out to me as a good fit. Marc, Marco, Marcus, March, Cello, Lo?

· My favorite is Santino and we would call him Santi or Santos. (My runner up is Xavier, it's been on my list since I was in grade school, but the hubbie thinks it's "weird"?)

Anyway, can you give some insight on what you think of these two names, or perhaps some other names that might seem to fit?

Thank you so much!
Carly

PS: Here is a small list of names that one of us liked but was dismissed

Theo
Dominic (most likely still on the list, but not at the top)
Milo
Sebastian
Vincenzo
Mason
Lucas
Dante
Elias
Damian
Cruz

PPS: I absolutely promise to write back with an update on what we've chosen!

I know very little about Italian names, so I'm working here with the Italian sections of The Baby Name Wizard, The Best Baby Names in the World From Around the World, and The Oxford Dictionary of First Names. I'm trying to choose names that will sound good in the U.S., which could very well mean I'm choosing the names that in actual Italy would sound like Erwin and Dudley.

I have a long-running campaign to promote the name Karl, which I think is vastly underused. Recently a celebrity named a baby boy Carlo, which seemed like it had potential for helping to bring the name into use: the popular o-ending! Plus, while still being definitely Italian, it's recognized and easy to spell and pronounce. So that is my first suggestion: Carlo Ryan Doorahzio. It might be too close to Carly, or it might be a nice way to combine names: the father's surname and an Italian first name---but one that reflects the mother's name.

Matteo has been rising in popularity, perhaps also because of that o-ending. It gives the nicknames Matt and also Teo (TAY-o). As pointed out in the comments section, this might be too close to the name Matthew---or it might be a nice namesake name without being a junior, especially if he goes mostly by Teo.

Or Nico would be nice. Nico Ryan Doorahzio.

I'm also drawn to the Gian- names. I think those sound handsome. I like Giancarlo even more than Carlo. Gianluca would give him the nicknames Luca and Luke.

I like nicknames like Kip and Chip and Skip, so Cipriano appeals to me. On Forvo it sounds like a cross between a "sip" sound and a "chip" sound, and I think I'd use Chip as a nickname for anyone who had trouble with the full name.

Gus is a nickname trying to join Max and Sam and Jack; the main thing holding it back is the difficulty of choosing a longer version. Because you're specifically looking for an Italian name (and it sounds like you'd like a nickname), I suggest Augusto, nickname Gus. [It's pointed out in the comments section that Gus is already the dog's name. I'll leave this suggestion here anyway, for future reference for parents looking for Italian names.]

Baby Boy Smith, Brother to Carson Michael

2012-01-27T08:34:00.005-06:00

S. writes:

I am due on March 24, so I have less than 10 weeks left. We currently have a two year old named Carson Michael. We are having another boy. Last name is Smith. I cannot for the life of me choose a name for this baby. I want a family name somewhere in the name, so Jackson, Jordan, Owen, and Britt are possibilities.

Now to talk about what we have considered. Actually at this point I don't think there is a name that I haven't considered.

My favorite names are Jackson, Hudson, and Silas. Jackson and Hudson don't work because they end in -son like my first son's name. Silas ends how my last name begins, and is too hissy sounding with all the s's.

My husbands favorite name is Levi. It just doesn't click with me. It feels very religious to me.

We have seriously considered a number of names in addition to the ones above, but I find something wrong with each. Here goes:

Jordan- worried about the unisex aspect, too many girls using it now?
Brady- my family names don't go with it for the middle (I refuse to give him the initials BJ)
Owen-too old sounding it was a great grandparents name, so I picture a 95 year old
Brody-same issue as Brady
Trevor-people say it sound "snobby" and pretentious
Noah- No, Noah sounds like a stutter and we are afraid our two year old will be confused with all the "No" sounds
Parker-i never liked it until recently, but I think the strong R sounds makes it hard to say especially with Carson

Husband had vetoed:
Ryan
Kyle
Connor
Tanner
Grant

Please tell me you will help!!!! I honestly have been crying for the last two days every time I try to settle on something. I hate this! I find something wrong with every name. I feel alot of pressure especially since my first son was born a month early! I may not have much time left!!

I don't think the "No" sound in Noah is going to be confusing to your older child, any more than it will confuse your second child that his older brother's name has the words "car" and "son" in it. If it really did turn out to be an issue, it wouldn't be an issue for very long. And if I think back to the Noah I had in my daycare class, I don't remember the no-no issue being a problem at all: the pause for the comma, and the W-sound in the middle of Noah, keep it from sounding stuttery. Perhaps some parents of Noahs can weigh in on whether this has been a problem for them.

A name with some similar sounds (but no "no") is Rohan. Rohan Smith; Carson and Rohan.

I might in general prefer to avoid having two sibling names ending with -son, but there's no rule against it. If you and your husband can agree on the name Jackson or Hudson, and you both love the name, there is nothing wrong with naming two brothers Carson and Jackson, or Carson and Hudson.

I can see how having an elderly relative named Owen would affect the sound of the name for you. Does it help at all that it's in the top 50 for boys right now? As with many names, it has cycled around again: names first sound too elderly to use, then sound vintage and appealing, then sound totally current. Owen is already sounding current, with only a hint of vintage remaining. It fits in beautifully with other revived no-longer-elderly-sounding names such as Ava, Henry, and Emma.

I like the sound of Carson and Parker together. I think the R sound ties them together. Maybe it ties them together a little too well, since it's more of a matching ar-sound than just an r-sound. Maybe Porter would be better? Porter Smith; Carson and Porter.

Jordan is one of the few truly unisex names. Even though it's used for many baby girls, it hasn't dropped at all out of the running for boys---especially since many girls use feminized spellings such as Jordyn and Jordynn.

Another good unisex name is Riley. It has the il-sound from Silas, but without the s-ending problem. Riley Smith; Carson and Riley.

If you like Silas but the ending S is a problem, do you like Simon instead?

If not Levi, would you prefer Leo?

If Trevor isn't quite right, would Truman do? Or Everett? Or Evan?

If you like Brady but the initials are a problem, do you like Grady instead? Grady Owen Smith; Carson and Grady.

Baby Boy Detwiler: Issues of Twilight and Beer

2012-01-25T09:21:00.008-06:00

Katie writes:

I am a longtime reader and thought I would be more than prepared for my own baby name experience once it arrived. Well, here it is... I am due on March 30th with a baby boy and i am anything BUT well prepared! I have 3 different issues going on; not wanting a top ten name, Twilight, and initials I don't know if I can use. To give you some background, my name is Katie, my husband's name is Jon, and our last name is Detwiler. I grew up in Amish Country, and we have an Amish sounding last name, so that's a factor for me as well, so I guess that's a fourth issue for me! I would like to avoid some of the typical Amish names. Jon has given me 2 top five lists, "Unusual Names" (that I don't think are actually that unusual) and "Normal Names."

Unusual Names:

Aksel
Soren
Maximus
Zander
Riddick

Normal Names:

Jakeb (yes, that's with an -eb at the end... Not going to happen)
Mason
Evan
Zeke
Finn

I seem to be having some mental block and can't even think of any names I think I like or are right for this poor little man, so we settled on Jakob Soren or Maximus Grey as our top two finalists.

These two finalists have produced all 4 of my issues. Jakob/Jacob is Jon's #1 name out of all 10... It has been in the top five names for what seems like a hundred years, it's Amish, and my sister in law is due a month before me and their girl name is Bella. Really. Maximus Grey gives us the initials MGD. I think we might have been ok a few years ago with these initials but then out came MGD 64... Does that even matter?

So I need to know if I should just get over any of these issues, or if you think any of them are actually legit. My pick is definitely Max, but those initials are bothering me. Also, if we were having a girl, we both like Ellie, but Jon preferred Eleanor and I preferred Eloise for her full name.

If you take a look at our style and have any new name suggestions as well, we're still definitely open to a change! Thank you!

I had to Google MGD 64 to see what the issue was. But I'm not a beer-drinker; if you were considering the name Smirnoff or even GNT I would have known what was what. And Jacob Detwiler wouldn't have made me think Amish.

But I think it can be tempting to dismiss anything as silly if it's not a familiar association: I haven't seen Titanic so Jack and Rose seems like a dismissible thing to worry about---but ask me about siblings Max and Ruby and I'm completely opposed: the associations I recognize seem shocking, while the associations someone ELSE recognizes seem barely worth considering---only because they're not important TO ME, which is not the question when we're talking about the societal impact of a name. With the polls I always want to separate out the opinions of the people who HAVE the association from the people who don't. Let's have a poll over to the right and see if we can do that even though it makes the response options kind of LONG.

It seems too that the MGD issue would be a simple problem to fix, unless you're totally set on Grey as the only middle name you want to consider. Even if you think the initials are a deal-breaker, that doesn't rule out the name Max.

While I might not name siblings Edward and Bella, I don't see a problem with Jacob and Bella for cousins. The name Bella is fairly strongly associated with Twilight (though all the Bellas, as well as all the Isabellas going by Bella, help to reduce that), but Jacob is common enough to have an even more diluted set of associations. And Bella and Jacob don't end up together romantically, right? So it's not a connection that would bother me. But again, we have the personal associations factoring in: I skimmed the first Twilight book and that's it, so of course the association would seem insignificant to me. What we want is SOCIETY'S reaction. Let's have a second poll over to the right about this issue.

Between Jacob and Maximum, my own favorite is Jacob. Jacob Detwiler seems like a nice boy, and handsome. And J.D. makes a cute initial nickname, if you want it.

From the entire list, my favorite is Soren Jacob. It lets your husband have his favorite name but without the Jacob/Bella issue, the Top Ten issue, or the Amish Name issue.

We recently discussed Maxon/Maxton, if you'd want to consider a different long form for Max.

Because you have Zander and Zeke, I wonder if you would like Xavier?

Evan from your list makes me think of Ian. But it gives the initials I.D., if you want to avoid that. (A D-surname sure is hard to work with for those of us who prefer not to spell anything with initials! 2012 A.D., CD, double-D, ED, fire dept, g-d, high definition, show your I.D., M.D., O.D., police dept, Rd., etc.)

Be sure to vote in both polls to the right (er, I mean if you WANT to); it's common when we do two polls for the first of the two polls to get significantly more votes than the second. Heck, let's throw in one more poll: Jacob or Maximus? And be sure to leave other suggestions in the comments section.

Name Updates!

2012-01-23T19:08:00.003-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy Moncla, Brother to Lucy and Eli!
Update on Baby Boy/Girl Twins Hoffman!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Twin Girls Lavender, Sisters to Cohen Fox!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy or Girl Phillips: Namesake Issues!

Baby Name to Consider: Maxon

2012-01-23T12:57:00.006-06:00

Beth writes:

As I was driving to my daughter's class today, a sign I drive by often caught my attention as a name to consider. Maxon. I've never heard of a baby named this, but it sounds like so many popular names--Max! Jackson! Mason! that I wondered if someone who didn't have this name in their family tree would consider it. What do you think?

Oh, interesting! It adds another way to get the nickname Max, and it ties in with the name Jaxon. Or it could be spelled Mackson, if someone preferred the nickname Mac/Mack.

I see in 2010 there were 55 baby boys named Maxon, plus another 14 named Maxen, 9 named Maxxon, and 7 named Maxin. It looks like it appeared in the Social Security database in 1997, but hasn't really caught on yet.

I wonder why it HASN'T risen more rapidly, considering it fits so well with Max and Jaxon and Jackson? The similarity in sound to the men's magazine Maxim might help it or might hurt it (312 boys named Maxim were born in 2010). Associations with maxi pads seem like they'd be damaging, but then they should be equally damaging to all the Max names. It makes me think of "Wax on, wax off" from The Karate Kid---but that ought to be just as damaging to Jaxon and Jackson. I wondered if it might be a reluctance to branch out into rhyming names, but that didn't stop Caden/Braden/Jaden/Greydon.

Let's have a poll over to the right to see what we think of the name, but let's also discuss in the comments section why we think it HASN'T taken off.

Harris or Harrison Hamilton?

2012-01-22T14:19:00.009-06:00

L. writes:

We are expecting our first baby, a surprise, February 22, 2012. My husband was very close to his grandfather, Harry, and my last name is Harris, so we think something in that vein would be meaningful. We have decided on Harriet for a girl, and both love it. (Her middle name would be Perrine, my mother's maiden name.) For a boy we had settled on Harrison, nickname Harry, but I am having doubts. (His middle name would be Matthew, after my husband.) Here are some concerns:

The baby's last name will be Hamilton, my husband's last name. I worry that Harrison Hamilton is too singsongy, and the two last names are too interchangeable (sounds very similar to Hamilton Harrison). My husband points out that Harry Hamilton, what our son will go by, doesn't come off that way (although he is a bit worried about the alliteration).

I am also worried that, although the name isn't overly popular at the moment (consistently in the 200s in the Social Security database for the last couple of decades), the -son ending for boys is pretty trendy right now (Jackson, Mason, Grayson, Hudson, etc.) and Harrison has recently become very popular in Australia and England, which might suggest it's about to catch on here in the U.S. Because my husband and I both went through school sharing our names with lots of classmates, we're hoping to avoid putting our kid in the same situation.

I do think it's a solid, sweet name with lots of significance for our family. It would be cute on a little boy and respectable on a man. And as an Indiana Jones/Beatles fan, my husband is happy with those associations.

The alternative is Harris, which doesn't end with -son and isn't even in the top 1000, popularity-wise. It also seems to flow better with Hamilton. But it is my last name--is that weird?--and my husband likes it less, although he is open to it. It also sounds less "name-y" in this day and age than Harrison.

Your advice would be appreciated!

I vastly prefer Harris Hamilton to Harrison Hamilton, for all the reasons you mention. Furthermore, I have a huge soft spot for the mother's maiden name (whether or not the mother is still using it) used as a child's name: I think it's a meaningful and touching choice, especially when the child will be receiving his father's first name as his middle name, as well as his father's surname.

Or there's the option of just naming him Harry. It's not so nicknamey that it can't stand on its own. This is particularly appealing if your husband's grandfather's given name was Harry.

Let's have a poll over to the right, to see what everyone else thinks. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Baby Girl or Boy Spam, Sibling to Bianca

2012-01-20T05:23:00.003-06:00

Monica writes:

I am due with our second child at the beginning of February. We do not know what we are having, and cannot come up with a boy’s name. We have a 2 yr old daughter named Bianca Jolien. We call her ‘B’ or Bia. If the baby is a girl, she will be Daphne (unsure of middle name). We could easily agree on a girl’s name; however, we are having difficulty coming up with a boy’s name. It may be because I have too many ‘rules’. I don’t want the name to start with a ‘M’ as my husband is Martin and I am Monica, I want the name to be more than one syllable as our last name is one syllable (sounds like ‘Spam’), and I don’t want a trendy or overly common name, but also not a name that is too unheard of. Every name I come up with, my husband says it in Dutch, and it does not work. Having said that, I don’t want an exclusively Dutch name (like Jaap or Cees)! Like I said, I have lots of ‘rules’!

A commonly used boy’s name in Holland right now is Lucas, which I like, and especially like the nn Luke. I’m not sure though because it ends with ‘S’ and our last name starts with ‘S’. What are your thoughts? Yes, generally we will use Luke, but officially it will be Lucas ‘Spam’. I’m afraid it sounds too much like Luca ‘Spam’ when spoken. I don’t want to simply name him Luke as I’d like him to have the option of using Lucas when he is older.

Names we have considered, but aren’t convinced:

Kiefer – Husband likes, I used to like it too, but now feel it is too ‘different’.

Willem – Dutch form of William. I like the nn Will, but worry about how common this will be, and really dislike the nn Willy.

Wilco – same as above, it is a commonly used name in Holland, but worry it is too different.

Graydon – like the nn Grady, not crazy about Graydon

Henry – don’t like the nn Hank, and hubby isn’t crazy about the name

Callum

Griffin – love the nn Finn, but a friend recently named her son Griffin

We are planning on having only 2 children, so as of now, it’ll be Bianca and Daphne or Bianca and Baby Boy...HELP!

I think Willem is a wonderful choice, and I think you can avoid Willy unless he himself chooses it, which seems unlikely. The main downside of the name, I think, is that the popularity of the name William could create constant misunderstandings and misspellings as people assume you've said/written William.

I agree with you about names running into each other. I think if I loved a name above all others and with the passion of at least one or two suns, I would use it anyway, and then I would practice saying the name distinctly, with a pause: "Lucas. Spam." Or, as I imagine going up to the reception desk at school or at the doctor's office, I might say, "This is Lucas. Lucus Spam." Yes, I think that would work fine. But the issue would knock the name lower on my list.

The name Wilco has seized my imagination. It seems just wonderful. It has the easy nickname Will, but without Willem's problem with being confused with William. It's distinctive and Dutch and easy to explain to anyone whose eyebrows go up ("My husband is Dutch; it's a common Dutch name"), and especially with that -o ending I think it has huge potential for crossover to U.S. usage. My guess is that the only reason it HASN'T crossed over is that people haven't heard of it. Or possibly because the -co ending might sound a little corporate? But that's not what comes to mind with Marco or Nico or Rocco. In your particular family, I wonder if it's too many C+vowel endings: Monica, Bianca, and Wilco.

If you like Finn but can't use Griffin, there's also Finnegan, Phineas, Fintan, or straight Finn.

If you like Grady, I'd go directly to that: it's a stand-alone name, and I think Graydon sounds like a Braden-offshoot name invented to give Grady a more formal version.

I don't like the matching M-endings of Callum Spam. I wonder if you'd like Calvin? Calvin Spam; Bianca and Calvin; Bia and Cal.

I love Kiefer best. It's energetic and unusual, but familiar and completely fits in with the current fashion for surname names, as well as fitting beautifully with Bianca. Kiefer Spam. Bianca and Kiefer. I love that so much, it's tempting to pressure you.

Baby Boy Purant-with-a-D

2012-01-19T08:14:00.003-06:00

Lauren writes:

My husband and I were sure we were having a girl until our ultrasound said otherwise! We have one boy's name that we had both liked early on (Oscar), but now that it's "real" I'm not sure it's right for our son. And with time ticking (we're due in May, but I'm a planner), my husband is quick to veto but unable to come up with his own suggestions! We actually do agree on general ideas (not too trendy or popular, we like traditional/old-timey/preppy names, and we have no syllable/vowel/whatever preferences or requirements about it) but when it comes to specifics, we're having some trouble. My husband's name is Fletcher which he and I both LOVE. We have only met one other Fletcher ever but it's not a "weird" name by any means. We would love to find something just like that for our boy!

My absolute favorites are Griffin and Fisher, but he's not sold on either of them yet. Names we both generally like include Felix, Oscar, Owen, Milo, and Henry, but we think that the last three are too trendy (we love Liam, but that has the same problem). Our tastes do diverge, though. I love names like Connor, Cooper, Hunter, Jonah, Jude, Miles, Miller, Rowan, Sawyer, and Spencer--none of which he likes enough (and some he hates!). He loves Elliot but I like it better as a middle name. Other middle names we like include Leighton, Freeland, and Montgomery (all family names, though that's not a stipulation). His last name will be my husband's last name which starts with a D and rhymes with Purant (think the sound a cat makes plus the insect)--so names like Grant are out. I also don't like D first names with a D last name.

Anyway, as you can see, we could use some help! Is Fisher too matchey with my husband's name? Is there a good middle name for Griffin that would make my husband love it? Are we missing that magic name? Is there a combination in all of these that we aren't seeing?? There's a good chance that this will be our only child but it's possible that we'll have one more. If we were having a girl, we would have named her Mabel, Clementine, or Clara.

Many thanks and Happy New Year!! I promise to send an update AND a picture when our son arrives. And because you seem like the kind of person who might like this, here's a preview of what he looks like. The caption would read "Hi Swistle, please help name me!"

This is a suggestion you have certainly thought of, but I am going to go right ahead and make it anyway because it's kind of an uncommon to start up in our generation: how would you feel about having a junior? You and your husband both love your husband's name, and you'd both like something just like that for your son---so perhaps go right for it?

Or he wouldn't have to be a full junior: you could give him a different middle name, to reduce confusion and to let you still have the fun of choosing at least one new name.

If you'd rather not, but you wouldn't mind using something very close, Thatcher or Archer would be adorable. (I learned just this minute from The Baby Name Wizard that a fletcher is an arrow-maker, so that makes Archer particularly appealing for that connection.) Fisher is a great name and I want to finally know someone who uses it---but I think it's confusing/tongue-twisting with Fletcher (I keep getting Flesher and Fitcher.)

I wish he liked Miller. That seems like a really good one.

Instead of Elliot: Everett or Emmett.

Instead of Liam: Leon.

Instead of Griffin: Gideon or Finnegan or Phineas.

I also love Felix from your list. When I was reading through the letter but before I'd gotten to that list, I thought "They like Oscar and Fletcher---I should suggest Felix!"

Milo might be a little trendy, helped in this impression by a couple of actresses who used the name for their sons. But it's been awhile since anyone famous used it, and I'm only willing to say "MIGHT" be a "LITTLE" trendy, and it was one of the three finalists for my youngest baby, and I still really like it for you. That little ultrasound hand-wave has the attitude of a Milo, and I think Milo has just the right mix of quirky and well-rooted.

Or would you like Nico instead? Or Theo? Or Leo? or Hugo? I think Hugo would be great: Hugo Purant.

I also think you might find Oscar is the right name after all, once you've had time to get used to him being a boy. Oscar is so great with the sister names, if you have a girl later on: Oscar and Mabel; Oscar and Clara; Oscar and Clementine.

Harrison just came to mind. It's surnamey like Fletcher, and it's nice with the surname: Harrison Purant.

For a middle name, I suggest your own surname if it's at all name-like.

For Griffin, Elliot seems like a good middle name to maybe tip your husband into using it: Griffin Elliot Purant. One downside is that the initials would spell GED, like the high school equivalency exam, but for me I don't THINK that would be a deal-breaker.

The names Fletcher, Felix, Oscar all have a sort of crackle in them. Looking for other such names:

Aidric
Atticus
Baxter
Beckett
Declan (starts with D, I know, but I want it in the list anyway)
Ezekiel
Frederick
Haskell
Jasper
Lennox
Marcus
Mattias
Micah
Nicholson
Paxton
Walker
Winston

Or here's a long-shot to consider: Pascal. It takes a little getting used to, but I think it has huge potential: familiar yet almost unused in the U.S., and very similar in sound to names like Oscar and Felix, and with a super sciencey namesake to boot. Pascal Mother-Surname Purant-with-a-D.

Baby Boy or Girl Fitzpatrick, Sibling to Hugh and Claire

2012-01-18T09:20:00.005-06:00

Sarah writes:

I've enjoyed reading your advice. I wonder if you could help my husband and I....I'm due in two weeks (end of Jan. 2012) and we're still struggling (stressing a bit) with baby names. We have two children (Hugh Thomas age 4, Claire Ann age 3). We don't know if we're having a boy or a girl. (Hugh is a family name...starting with my grandfather and it goes way back and Thomas is my father-in-law. Claire was just a name we liked and Ann is a favorite family name on both sides.) Our last name is Irish - sounds like Fitzpatrick. My husband's ancestry is all Irish - I'm of Irish and Scottish descent.

One boy name that we both like is Grant Regan. Grant is another family name and Regan is a family surname. I would love your thoughts on a quick question regarding this...do you think we're crazy to have sons named Hugh and Grant since there is an actor named Hugh Grant? (For the record I like Hugh Grant so I don't have bad associations with his name.)

Some of the other boys names we're considering are:

George Regan (George - after my father + husband's grandfather)
Cormac Regan (Cormac - a shortened version of a family surname name)
Cormac George

Our hesitation with Cormac is that there are conflicting defintitions - one is impure son (not so nice), others are son of charioteer or raven. I'm not sure how much weight to give these definitions or if I should let the family tie of the name matter more.

For girls we're even more lost. Here are some we've been thinking of:

Alexandra Christine (I've always loved Alexandra and Christine is after my late mother-in-law)
Alexandra Regan
Alexandra Jane
Sadie Christine
Mollie Katherine
Katherine Regan
Alice Regan
Alice Christine
Georgia Regan
Abigail Regan
Flora Christine

Any thoughts or ideas would be most welcome!

I will make this quick so the other commenters can get at it too: it's already been a week since you wrote, so TIME IS SHORT.

Brothers named Hugh and Grant immediately bring the actor to mind, and for me it's to startling and comic effect. Like siblings named Ronald and Reagan, or Charles and Darwin. I vote no---but with great regret. If nothing else, I think you and they would get completely fed up with people remarking on the connection.

Instead I suggest Graham (even this is a little close, but it helps that there is a sister in between), Reid, or Dean. (I wish I could recommend Clark, too, but I think it's too close to Claire.)

And I love your idea of George, and feel like pushing you to use it. George Regan! Very handsome. That's my favorite.

The iffy definition of Cormac wouldn't bother me. I looked it up in The Oxford Dictionary of First Names, and it says "Traditional Irish name of uncertain origin." This name, like many, many, many others, has no standard meaning; meanings found in other books have been made up (with various degrees of legitimacy) to please people who like all names to have meanings.

The family tie is definitely more important here: the meaning of the name becomes THAT connection, rather than something from a baby name book, just as the meaning of George for your family is "mother's father and father's grandfather" rather than "farmer." And I would get a copy of the Oxford book, put it on the bookshelf, and refer to that if little Cormac ever looks up his name in some other book and comes to you to confront you with your choice. "The Oxford Dictionary says so, Cormac!" you can say. "Uncertain origin!"

Wasn't I planning to make this SHORT? Then we'd better move along to girl names.

With Claire, my stand-out favorite from your great list is Alice. In the next tier of favorites are Georgia, Abigail, Flora, and Mollie (which I'd spell Molly unless the spelling has significance).

I also suggest Eve and Eliza and Rose.

Let's turn it over to the commenters now. Which boy name and girl name are your favorites for Baby Fitzpatrick?

Name Update!

2012-01-16T18:55:00.000-06:00

Update on Baby Girl James, Sister to Max Oliver!

Baby Boy Thompson, Brother to Charlotte Grace

2012-01-12T05:56:00.003-06:00

Teresa writes:

Hello there Swistle! I've been reading your blog (semi-obsessively) for some time now and have often thought of writing, but always talked myself out of it (because I know you guys get so much mail). Now, however, I'm reaching a desperate point. I am pregnant with #2, a little boy, due May 22. My husband is deploying and will be leaving in March, and since he'll miss the birth, the 2 baby-related bonding-type things I had hoped we'd be able to do together was the ultrasound and agreeing on a name. The ultrasound is done, but now we are stuck. We are in completely different galaxies when it comes to boy names.

Our daughter is named Charlotte Grace (which wasn't as popular when we chose it as it is now). Our last name is Thompson. My favorite names so far are Oliver, Atticus, and Abraham (Abraham is my favorite by far). My husband can't tolerate any of those. He prefers names like Timothy and Andrew, which are great names, just not for this baby. The one name that we theoretically *could* compromise and agree on is Calvin, but I'm not totally sold on it. If we have more children and didn't start their name with a C name, would they feel left out? (I feel like this may be less of a concern because Charlotte doesn't have a hard "c" sound, but am still not totally sure.) I do not want a first name that begins with T. My initials have always been TT, and I think it is too much of a strong T-sound.

We go to a fairly small, very close-knit church with an abundance of baby boys, so there are QUITE a few names that are out (and these are only the names that would be in the same class as this baby). Names that are out: Judah, Christian, Elijah, Levi, Luke, Seth, Sebastian, Liam, Ethan, Griffin/Finn.

We both liked Tobias at first, until we started test-driving it (and then we both liked it a lot less). And related Elias is out because of a horrible person one of us knew. Jeremiah could be a candidate, but it's a name that I only like and do not love. If this baby was a girl, she would have been named Opal Elizabeth, which is a name that I really DO love, so now I'm just having a hard time settling for a boy name that I can only tolerate. Does that make any sense? I would prefer a less common name - I am not against popular names just for the sake of being different, but so our kid wouldn't always have to be identified by their first name and last initial. I theoretically love Puritan/Colonial names, but looking through list after list of those types of names, I have found nothing inspirational.

Any help or guidance you could give would be greatly appreciated! Because of some training my husband has, he is only going to be home for another 5 weeks or so before he leaves in March. For some reason I am really feeling the time crunch lately, and for some other reason (probably crazy pregnancy hormones, I'm guessing), the thought of having to agree on a name via Skype with him across the world makes me cry. (Though I am thankful for the existence of Skype that will allow us to keep in touch, I really am. I just want the name agreeing to be done in person.)

Thank you again for your time!

To me, it's the third name in a row that causes the real pressure---but I do feel some pressure even with a second name in a row, so I'd understand if you wanted to avoid a C name. But if I heard of a sibling group Charlotte, Calvin, and Opal, I wouldn't think, "What, did they run out of C names?" (with Charlotte, Calvin, Colin, and Opal, I might). And although I'm sure we could find adults still upset that they didn't share initials with their siblings, my guess is that the majority of children don't care about such things unless it's really blatant (and even then, we get people who say it made them feel special, not excluded). If you DID have Charlotte, Calvin, Colin, and Opal, and you said, "Opal, I waited through TWO BOYS to get to use your name!," it seems like there'd be very little room left for feeling neglected.

I think Calvin would be a wonderful choice. It seems like an excellent compromise between your husband's style and your own, and I'm not sure we can do any better than that. Which is not to say we won't try, because trying is fun.

Henry is another name that I think can bridge the gap between Oliver and Andrew. Henry Thompson is great, I think. But what really sells it to me is the sibling name set: Charlotte and Henry. I love that. I love it enough that I had a little heart attack thinking "Wait, is it in their church group??"---followed by a very pleasant headrush when it wasn't.

If Henry is too common, I wonder if you'd like Harvey. That's a name that never would have caught my eye if I hadn't been a fan of Sabrina the Teenage Witch. The cool-but-nice boyfriend is named Harvey.

Tobias and Elias make me think of Silas. Silas Thompson; Charlotte and Silas.

Silas makes me think of Simon. Simon Thompson. Too rhymey, or nicely tied together? Charlotte and Simon is a pair I like almost as much as I like Charlotte and Henry.

Henry and Silas make me think of Harris. Harris Thompson; Charlotte and Harris.

I looked up lists of signers of the Constitution and signers of the Declaration of Independence to see if any early U.S. names stood out. In those lists I found what I consider a real option, a name that came up again and again---but it's the kind of name I feel like I need to introduce by saying something like "Now don't reject it right away! Let it sink in!" It's George. George Thompson. Charlotte and George. I like George enough to consider it using it myself, but it took awhile to start seeing it as a real name candidate, and I'm not sure why. Maybe it's a name like John, so familiar it sort of flits right past without sinking in? But think for a moment of George Clooney. See? GEORGE. I think it's the kind of name that has the potential to be a continual pleasant surprise: it's got dignity and it's got charm and it's got HISTORY. (And it's got Clooney.)

Another is Philip. A friend named her son Philip, and it has been such a successful name. I'm not sure I noticed it when I read baby name books, but as soon as she mentioned it I thought "Philip!! Why have we not considered Philip??" Philip Johnson; Charlotte and Philip.

Another name that caught my eye was Nathaniel. That seems closer to your husband's tastes than to yours, but still might work as a compromise. Nathaniel Thompson; Charlotte and Nathaniel.

There's an Edmund listed under "Other Founders," and I think that name would work very nicely. Edmund Thompson; Charlotte and Edmund.

Looking over the list brought the name Joel (not on the lists) to mind. It has that hard-working early American sound. Joel Thompson; Charlotte and Joel.

Or Grant. Grant Thompson; Charlotte and Grant.

Name Updates!

2012-01-11T19:13:00.001-06:00

Update on Baby Girl M., Sister to Samuel John!
Update on Baby Naming Issue: Andromeda or Andi?

Baby Naming Issue: Place Names

2012-01-10T10:36:00.000-06:00

Traci writes:

You helped me out less than a year ago when we were expecting our first. Now we're expecting AGAIN.
Besides the craziness that is having two babies less than a year apart, we have a new naming issue.
We don't know the gender of this baby, but if it is a girl, we would like to name her Marina Lynn, after both our mothers. (His mother = Marina, Mine = Lynn). I love most everything about the name Marina. I love that my husband loves it, I love the way it sounds, I love that it is a precious namesake like our first child. The ONLY THING I don't like about it is that Marina is a thing in English. (A place, actually. "Let's have lunch at the marina.") To me, a name that is a thing/place like Marina is different than a name that is a thing like Rose. I can't explain why, exactly, but it just bothers me. As an avid reader of your site (and because you steered us so right the first time and we took your advice and couldn't be happier!) I thought that I'd get your take on it. Should I get over it? Is there a way to frame it that might help me get over it? I also thought of spelling it Marinah. Does that seem like a viable solution? Is there another solution I haven't thought of? I thought you might take the opportunity to talk about names that are things (or places) in general, to help more readers than just me.

Thank you!

This is the kind of question where I have to rein in my urge to PUSH you to use the name. You love it! It's a family name! Place names are a totally valid category of names! I want to FORCE the place issue not to bother you! But if something bothers, it bothers, and there's no "just don't let it" about it. So let's work on the reframing idea.

In this particular case, it would influence me whether you live near a marina or not. DO you ever suggest having lunch at the marina, or is there no marina? Proximity/confusion issues matter to me, which is why I also wouldn't suggest using Madison in or near Madison, Wisconsin, or Brooklyn in or near Brooklyn, New York---but wouldn't blink at either one of them used in Michigan. But of course people can move later on, so it still doesn't dismiss the point.

It also matters to me how tied the name is to the place. I don't immediately think of Madison and Savannah and Florence as place names even though I know they are; Georgia is definitely a place name but also strongly a name-name; and India and Ireland are places until I shake off the confusion and realize that in this case it's someone's name. For me, Marina is somewhere between Savannah and Georgia: I'd know it was a place, and I'd know to take that into account---but it wouldn't bother me to use it, even knowing that the child might later move to Georgia or near a marina/savannah.

In fact, maybe it would help to think how quickly a place association can vanish. Brittany! Austin! Jordan! Devon! Cody! Chelsea!

Or, this one may backfire, but: do you think of a marina whenever your mother-in-law's name comes up? (If so, never mind and forget I said anything.) Has anyone you know ever commented on the connection? ("Marina? Oh, like the place we have lunch!")

Or it helps me to think about how serious a situation it would be if the connection WERE made, or if the child DID move later on. How much of a problem/issue would it be for a girl named Madison to live in Wisconsin? There were 152 more of them born there last year, so my guess is it's not too bad. And Brooklyn is #15 in New York even though it's only #34 nationally. Place names are common honor names, so the connection can be a positive one.

Do you LIKE marinas? If someone hates roses, Rose is probably a non-starter of a baby name for them; but if they love roses, it adds to the appeal and makes the name an even more personal choice. The appeal of a forest or a haven or a savannah or a sky can be the very thing that makes someone CHOOSE a name like Forrest or Haven or Savannah or Skye.

Marinas are pretty
(screenshot from Google images search result)

It's too bad about Mirena, or I'd recommend that spelling. Marinah looks like mah-RY-nah to me, probably because of Mariah. I suppose you could use Marena (though I might say that one mare-ree-na or mah-RAY-nah instead of mah-REE-nah), but I think it's probably best to stick with the standard spelling.

Middle Name Challenge: Rhys Kelly or Olive Kelly

2012-01-08T12:15:00.000-06:00

Alison writes:

Hi there! Came across your blog in search of a non-lame baby naming source, and I am already swooning over you and your worker bees.

Here's our situation.

Background: Husband in a musician, I'm an corp junkie and a yoga/dance teacher during my off hours.

Requirements: Want a non-lame name, that works for a rockstar, a poet or a school teacher. As versatile as possible. We have no middle name requirements, As long at it sounds great, we are happy.

We are unsure of the sex of the baby although we will be hoping to find out prior to the birth. Although our first pregnancy, my husband comes from a massive family so many traditional/biblical names are spoken for. Not that I'm religious (as we are not) but just a heads up. Also, our pets names are Seamus, Pickles and Bonham. Just in case you were thinking Pickles :)

For a boy, we love the name Rhys. Our last name is Kelly, so we want to find a middle name that completes what we deem is a rockin' name.

For a girl, we have yet to find any names that we love. Names that we like but not love are Juliet, Violet and Sloan.

Thanks in advance for your help and your tremendous blog.

and

So we discovered we love Olive as a girls name, but again stuck on a middle name.

If you don't have specific plans for the middle name, it's a good place for an honor name: a family member, a family surname, your maiden name, a musician or author you admire, a place of significance.

Other possibilities:

Rhys Darwin Kelly
Rhys Desmond Kelly
Rhys Edmund Kelly
Rhys Everett Kelly
Rhys Ezra Kelly
Rhys Frederick Kelly
Rhys Gabriel Kelly
Rhys Hugo Kelly
Rhys Liam Kelly
Rhys Merrit Kelly
Rhys Milo Kelly
Rhys Matthias Kelly
Rhys Turner Kelly
Rhys Walker Kelly
Rhys Warren Kelly
Rhys Wilson Kelly

Olive Bianca Kelly
Olive Cordelia Kelly
Olive Francesca Kelly
Olive Geneva Kelly
Olive Harlow Kelly
Olive Jane Kelly
Olive Josephine Kelly
Olive Leticia Kelly
Olive Linnea Kelly
Olive Louisa Kelly
Olive Margot Kelly
Olive Mattea Kelly
Olive Melina Kelly
Olive Minerva Kelly
Olive Noelle Kelly
Olive Padgett Kelly
Olive Sabrina Kelly
Olive Silvia Kelly
Olive Simone Kelly
Olive Sterling Kelly
Olive Winifred Kelly
Olive Winslow Kelly

Baby Boy Like-Miller-with-a-B, Brother to Callum Daniel

2012-01-07T12:37:00.004-06:00

Kimberly writes:

We are expecting our second child, another boy, in early May! Our older son’s name is Callum Daniel. In an earlier post, you suggested Callum and Liam for twin boys’ names, and I’m wondering if you could please poll your readers to get their opinion on whether Callum and Liam sound too similar in a sibling set. Your opinion, of course, is much appreciated as well! Other first names under serious consideration are Andrew and Aiden (very popular in our region); the middle name is undecided but of less concern. Our naming guidelines are:

· No beginning or ending in B

· No names that are things (our surname is a thing)

· No two-syllable names that end in “er” (too sing-songy with our last name)

We had planned to use Amelia for a girl, and we are undecided on whether we will have more children.

If you choose to publish my question and need to use a substituted last name, I recommend “sounds like Miller with a B.”

Though I spend a lot of time lurking, I really appreciate your down-to-earth advice on naming and parenting in general!

Thank you,

I think my vote is that Callum and Liam are a little too close, but not deal-breakingly close: that is, if you love both names and decide to use them, there are plenty of sibling sets where the names are a little more similar than would be ideal (or even quite a bit more similar than would be ideal) but it's completely fine and not enough reason to give up a favorite name.

A name I love with Callum is Declan. They share some sounds, so perhaps they too are too similar, but they sound more different to my ear.

If you love Aidan but find it too popular in your area, I wonder if you'd like Aidric? I'm surprised it isn't more common.

Eamon would also fit very well. I recommend it second to Aidric because Aidric seemed easy to pronounce/spell even the first time I heard of it, but I've had to learn that Eamon is AY-mon (as opposed to EE-mon) and I still have to think about it.

I heard a little boy addressed as Garrett the other day, and it struck me that that's another name I could stand to hear more often.

Oh, Griffin! I like Griffin even more! Callum and Griffin; Cal and Finn! A griffin is sort of a thing, though. I say "sort of" because I"m not sure what percentage of the population is familiar with that (almost everyone? only certain segments?), and I also wonder if the name is established enough that the connection to the thing doesn't spring readily to mind; and because I think of the thing as being spelled gryphon (because of, I think, ONE book I read with a gryphon in it).

Well, if Griffin is out for thingness, I think I like Keegan even better anyway. It means two names starting with the same sound; would that make you feel stuck with a third child, if you had one? Callum and Keegan. I love that.

Enough chit-chat; let's have that poll about Callum/Liam over to the right! [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results for "What do you think of Callum and Liam as brother names?" (358 votes total):

Too similar to use - 94 votes (26%)
A little too similar, but fine to use - 158 votes (44%)
Not too similar - 99 votes (28%)
Can't decide - 7 votes (2%)

Baby Girl K., Sister to Emma Mae

2012-01-04T10:01:00.004-06:00

R. writes:

Our baby girl is due Feb. 13, 2012. Last name starts with a K. We are looking for a name that will sound good with Emma Mae – that’s our first daughter who will be 15 months old when the new baby is born. I always wanted an Emma because of the Jane Austen novels and I like traditional/old fashioned names but nothing that is so old we’d be the first people to use the name in like 50 years. I’ve always loved Abigail, but we know too many Abby’s personally. I also like Mona but my husband doesn’t.

Some of our names we are going back and forth on are:

1st Choice currently - Evelyn Ann (Ann is my mother in law’s middle name) (Mae is my mom’s middle name) I like names that I can shorten to a nickname like this would be Evie Ann…I call our daughter Emmie Mae

Caroline or Carolina

Kaitlyn Ann --- would probably be called Katie Ann (This is my husband’s choice, I don’t like how it sounds with Emma personally)

If we ever have a boy our first choice would be Noah Michael, and we also like Joshua Allan, and Lucas Scott. So we’d like our baby girl’s name to sound good with those boy names as well. We’d like to have 4 kids.

Suggestions?

From your lists, Kaitlyn is the one that stands out to me as not fitting in with the others---either with the other girl names or with the potential future boy names. A name like Katherine would give you the nickname Katie, while keeping your name list in the old-fashioned/traditional theme. Or Kate is also a good stand-alone name, although then it doesn't sound right with the middle name.

Emmie and Evie seem too similar to me, but maybe they wouldn't be. I'm trying them aloud and can't decide.

It's too bad Abigail is out, because it seems to me like an excellent sister set with Emma. Do you like Gabrielle instead, with Gabby instead of Abby?

Or Annabel? It shares some of the sounds of Abigail, and I think it's so sweet with Emma. Emma and Annabel. It messes up your middle name choice, though.

I love Sadie with Emma, too, or Sophie, or Lucy, or Molly. Maybe Sophia, and have Emma/Sophia and Emmie/Sophie.

The Baby Name Wizard suggests Grace, Lily, Julia, Isabel, and Chloe. I especially like Lily, or maybe Lillian. Emma and Lillian; Emmie Mae and Lily Ann.

If you love Jane Austen, I suggest Jane. It's old fashioned, traditional, and underused but not at all unfamiliar. Emma and Jane is almost too wonderful. But as with Kate, it's choppy with the middle name.

I wonder if you'd like Charlotte. Emma and Charlotte; Emmie Mae and Lottie Ann.

Baby Name to Consider: Bretcher

2012-01-04T07:22:00.003-06:00

Amy writes:

This past Thanksgiving my brother-in-law was talking about my other brother in law and said "Well, Brett sure does." Brett, who is only ten, quickly responded with "Who's Bretcher?" The fact that Brett thought Bretcher sounded like a legitimate name got me thinking that it really does have a lot of the characteristics current, trendy boys names. It is an English surname, starts with the ever-popular Br sound, has an easy nickname in "Bret", and as a bonus, it rhymes with Fletcher. What do you think?

I think you're right: it has a lot going for it, name-candidate-wise. It FEELS like a name.

Going against it is the way it calls to mind the words wretch and retch.

What does everyone else think? Let's have a poll over to the right. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results for the question "What do you think of the name Bretcher?" (457 votes total):

I love it! I'd want to use it! - 0 votes (0%)
I like it! I'd want to consider it! - 8 votes (2%)
I like it for someone else's baby - 27 votes (6%)
No particular opinion either way - 19 votes (4%)
Slight dislike - 133 votes (29%)
Strong dislike - 270 votes (59%)

Baby Naming Issue: Preferences vs. Requirements

2012-01-01T06:19:00.003-06:00

Julia writes:

We have three boys and are expecting our fourth child, a girl, in early March. My name is Julia, my husband is Greg, and our surname is Holloway.

Our boys are Leo Sebastian (7), Asher Hugo (5), and Simon Frederick (2). We consider ourselves pros at naming boys. My husband and I are equal partners in the naming process and really enjoyed it with our sons. We absolutely adore their names and think we did a pretty damn good job with them. But we're starting to doubt our naming prowess with our daughter.

The problem is that we suck at naming girls. This is our first girl, and probably our last (we aren't sure if we want another child after this one), so we want her name to be absolutely perfect. If this baby was a boy he would have been Jude Atticus or Felix Alasdair, depending on what he looked like. Done deal, give me the birth certificate so I can sign it already. But this wee lass is a giant pain as we are absolutely stumped on her name.

I suppose the problem is that we're very conscientious about names. Like, we really like Ivy (it's honestly the only one we've found that we like), but discarded it because of the long "i" sound it shares with Simon's name. We don't want her name to begin or end the same as any of our sons' names and we don't want any of the same dominant sounds. And this rules out a lot of names.

We also don't want a name with an easy nickname, nor a name above two syllables.

Also we would like her name to end in a vowel, though it's not mandatory.

We know that we want her name to be feminine but not frilly, soft but strong, elegant yet playful. Does it even exist? Are we being way too picky?

We did look at the meanings for our sons' names when choosing them (Leo means "lion", Asher means "lucky/happy one", and Simon means "the listener") and while it's not TERRIBLY important we would like the meaning to be at least nice, if not wonderful.

Thank you, Swistle!

You are just as good at naming girls as you are at naming boys. The problem you're encountering is that you're setting up unnecessary requirements. "Not sharing a vowel sound with any siblings" is too strict when combined with "no more than two syllables," "no nicknames," "no sharing either beginning or ending sounds with a sibling," and "having four children."

It's important when choosing a baby's name to note the differences between requirements and preferences. A requirement might be something like "not creating a silly phrase with our surname." A preference might be something like "not starting with the same initial as a sibling name." Of course it will vary from situation to situation: in some families, different initials might be the requirement and making a silly phrase might be a goal. The main difference is that requirements must be VERY FEW, or else they create a logic puzzle that not one single name in the universe can satisfy. Preferences, on the other hand, may come in the form of long lists, because it is understood that any of them can be abandoned if a name meets most of them, or if a name is wonderful enough to be worth ditching them.

The first step, then, is to divide your long list of requirements into two lists, one of actual requirements, and one of preferences. With two or three children, I think it might be reasonable to want not to share any beginning sounds, any ending sounds, any dominant sounds, or any vowel sounds. With four children, I think it's time to re-evaluate that for actual importance. A family of Leo, Asher, Simon, and Ivy does not make me think "OMG, they repeated the long-I sound!! Don't they realize their children are INDIVIDUALS??" On the contrary, I'd think what a good job the family had done finding such completely different names that nevertheless went together well.

One way to separate out the requirements from the preferences is to ask yourself whether you think the rule is more important than the name---that is, whether you should dismiss a name you agree on and love, just because you've made an arbitrary rule and now the name doesn't meet it. Which is more important, the name or the rule you made? If you reluctantly say that the rule is more important (as you might if your surname were Dover and your favorite name were Ben), then what you have is a requirement. If you think, "Wait. No, that would be silly: if the name of our dreams, the name we can't bear not to use, is a name that has three syllables even though we said it couldn't have more than two, we don't actually have to let that rule boss us around," then what you have is a preference.

Preferences can be a helpful tool for sorting through enormous piles of names. And it's very satisfying to find a name that meets most or all of the preferences, which you might still do. But when preferences start running the show or making you feel frantic, or when every name you like is at the mercy of the preferences, that means the preference list is now the unreasonable boss rather than the helpful tool. You're the one setting the standards for what qualifies as perfection, so you are also the ones who can re-set those standards.

It sounds to me like the name you're looking for is Ivy. It doesn't have more than two syllables. It doesn't have an easy nickname. It ends in a vowel. It's feminine but not frilly. It's soft but strong. It's elegant but playful. It's wonderful with your surname, and with the sibling names. Eliminating it because it shares a single sound with a brother's name is not conscientiousness, it's pickiness. (And the name Felix would have repeated not only the long-E but also the only consonant sound of Leo.)

Now, if you don't love the name Ivy, that's a different story. In that case, we still need the section about requirements vs. preferences, but you also need name suggestions.

My first suggestion is Clara. It doesn't share the first or last sounds of any brother names. It's feminine, non-frilly, soft, strong, elegant, playful. It's not as good with your surname as Ivy, but it's still good: Clara Holloway. I suggest Felicity as the middle name, unless that would eliminate Felix for a future baby. Clara Felicity Holloway.

My second suggestion is Rose. It's gotten common as a middle name, but is still surprising and fresh as a first name, while also sounding classic and traditional: a very nice combination. Rose Holloway is wonderful. Leo, Asher, Simon, and Rose. I suggest Eliza as the middle name to emphasize the Z sound of both names: Rose Eliza Holloway.

My third suggestion is Phoebe. Elegant but playful. Two syllables. Ends in a vowel. Great with the brother names. Etc. I suggest the middle name Louise: Phoebe Louise Holloway.

My fourth suggestion is Beatrix. It has three syllables, or maybe more like 2.5, and it doesn't end in a vowel---but I reject those preferences in favor of this name. Talk about elegant but playful! Talk about feminine but non-frilly! BEATRIX, baby. It's similar to your boy name choice Felix, but without being as similar to Leo. I suggest the middle name Philippa: Beatrix Philippa Holloway.

My fifth suggestion is Greta. Look at how gorgeous it is with your surname. (I like Margaret even better, but that has tons of established nicknames.) I suggest Magnolia as the middle name: Greta Magnolia Holloway.

I think I'll stop counting my suggestions. Next up is Meredith. Three syllables, true; if that turns out to be one of the truly important requirements, then never mind. But man, what a great name with your surname and with the brother names. Leo, Asher, Simon, and Meredith! Meredith Holloway! Maybe put Ivy as the middle name, if it turns out not to work as a first name: Meredith Ivy Holloway.

Next is Ruth. Ruthie springs to mind as a nickname, but I love it with the brother names. Leo, Asher, Simon, and Ruth. A much more serious spin on the group than something like Phoebe, though. I'd put something light and feminine as the middle name; maybe Clarissa. Ruth Clarissa Holloway.

To maintain a lighter touch, maybe Ruby: Leo, Asher, Simon, and Ruby.

Ruby would make me think of Lucy, but I suspect that won't fly with Leo. But Lucy makes me think of Darcy, which I think fits better anyway: Leo, Asher, Simon, and Darcy.

Baby Name to Consider: Willoughby

2011-12-29T06:00:00.005-06:00

Rachael writes:

We are expecting our second baby in June! Our first is sweet Sylvia and I emailed you about why we chose to keep her name a secret until she was born in 2010. Loooong before Sylvia was born, my husband and I had settled on a girl name and a boy name that we both adored and loved and swore to always stand behind. No one has ever complained about Sylvia's name, especially since we kept it a secret. But with our boy name, I am much less confident, and alas - I'm stuck in this ancient and sacred promise I made to my husband.

He loves the name Willoughby.

We discussed this name after a few short months of dating and from the moment he mentioned it, I fell madly in love with it, too! It sounds British and sophisticated when I picture a grown up man, yet soft and cute for a cuddly baby boy. We agreed that he could have Willoughby for the first boy if I could have Sylvia for the first girl and that was all fine and good until I got pregnant and...now I'm afraid! I know my family will think it's weird. I'm not against anyone calling him Will if they really have to, but I think Willoughby goes so well with Sylvia and I hate how "Sylvia and Will" sound together. I'll be referring to my kids as "Sylvia and Willoughby - cutest siblings ever." I also know my family will think it's too long (our last name is four syllables, very Italian, ends in "iotto"). I know they'll say it's a terrible name and I'm afraid everyone will hate it!

Should that matter? I still love it - I can't find any other name I like more than this one. My husband would be devastated if I even mentioned another name to him, but this case of cold feet has me worried to pieces! Talk me down, Swistle. Tell me this name is perfectly okay!

Willoughby is definitely in a different league, surprise-wise. It's not even in the Social Security database for boys in 2010 (which means it could have been given to 0, 1, 2, 3, or 4 boys, but not as many as 5) (it was given to 6 girls), whereas Sylvia was #555.

I'm picturing it on grown men I know (my husband, my brother, my dad, my friends) and it is a little startle every time---in a way that another modern not-their-name such as Wilson is not. If I picture it on a cute little toddler or an elementary school child, it seems adorable.

The girl name Willow is an issue here: it gives a misleading clue. Ditto for girl names such as Shelby and Abby and Ruby and Libby and Gabby. On the other side of the scale is the common boy nickname Will and the -by ending boy names Colby and Bobby and Toby.

Length doesn't seem like it should be a concern, if they didn't object to Sylvia: both names have three syllables.

Whether everyone else's opinion should matter or not---well, it depends. On one hand, no, right? Parents get to name their own children. And it's classic for the grandparent generation to grouse about the names currently being used for babies: "Too weird! Why can't people use NORMAL names like the names WE used for OUR babies (which OUR parents thought were too weird)?" And of course there will always be some people who dislike the names we choose, no matter WHAT names those are. And it's also classic for people to come around to the names once they get used to it on the beloved baby.

On the other hand, this is why naming is such a huge responsibility: our children have to live in this society with the names we give them, and it's a hard row to hoe to live with a name everybody hates. And within our families and friend circles, of course we WANT people to respond favorably to the name, rather than cringing every time they say it.

So it's a matter of balance: weighing what we think society/family/friends will think of the name with what WE think of the name. This is one reason I like The Baby Name Wizard's test so much: she suggests considering whether you would like to be a child born now and given that name. I also like the test of looking around at grown-ups and imagining them with the name. And of course there's the careers test: imagine the name on a manager, a waiter, a coach, a lawyer, a teacher, a carpenter.

If a name fails too many tests, I think the middle name slot is an excellent place for it: there is still the happiness of using it, but without the downsides.

Promises to use a particular name shouldn't be made, or honored. Too much changes between the time the promise is made and the appearance of the actual baby. If you decide you're not comfortable using Willoughby (and I could be wrong about your feelings: I'm basing it on "alas" and "stuck," but the more important words could be "madly in love" and "afraid" and "cold feet"), it will be disappointing to your husband, but it's not something you have to feel contractually obligated to follow through on. My main advice for back-to-the-drawing-board situations is that the task is not to find a name the two of you like better than the name Willoughby, but rather to find your favorite from the names that remain. And also that both parents are responsible for finding the new options: this is not a matter of one parent needing to convince the other to dethrone a favorite.

Let's have a poll over to the right to see what everyone else thinks of the name Willoughby. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results for the question "What do you think of the name Willoughby?" (519 votes total):

I love it! I'd want to use it! - 39 votes (8%)
I like it! I'd consider it! - 58 votes (11%)
I like it for someone else's baby - 161 votes (31%)
No particular opinion either way - 21 votes (4%)
Slight dislike - 136 votes (26%)
Strong dislike - 104 votes (20%)

Name Updates!

2011-12-28T12:31:00.002-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy Julienelle, Brother to Gwen Grace!
Update on Baby Boy Faith, Brother to Cade and Colin
Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl DeMontel, Sister to Emery Jane!

Baby Boy Harris, Brother to Abig@il Elizabeth

2011-12-28T07:34:00.005-06:00

L. writes:

My husband and I had the perfect name picked out for our son who is due in early March, but our plan has fallen apart. We were going to name him after his two grandfathers Leon@rd (mine) James (his) and we were going to call him Leo. Even though we had told no one our name, this week my father made sure to let me know in no uncertain terms that he would never forgive me if I named this baby after him. Needless to say, I am heartbroken.

So, back to the drawing board we go. If this baby had been a girl, she would have been Eleanor (nickname Nora). I prefer older, traditional names (preferrably with a cute nickname). I also want to stay away from the top 10 names. (I would never have named Abby that if I'd realized at the time how popular her name was.) I do realize that Eleanor/Nora is also becoming more popular, but we love it for it's family significance. Of the names in the top 50 from the Social Security list for 2010, the only one that even pops out as a possibility is Isaac.

Things that are important to me for the name is that it have at least 2 syllables and not end in an S. (I like Charles, but Charles James Harris is a little much.)

One name that I like, but am unsure I could pull the trigger on if if my husband would agree, is Oswald. Help!

I feel like we need more information from your father. Why would he say such a thing? When he said it, did you ask what his reason was? I'm kind of looking forward to after the baby is born, when you can tell him that you WERE going to name the baby after him but then he screwed everything up. That was a GREAT NAME you'd chosen.

Leo and Charles were two of our top contenders for Henry, so I wonder if you'd like Oliver, also on our list. Oliver James Harris; Abigail and Oliver.

Another from that list was Elliot. Elliot James Harris; Abigail and Elliot.

Another from that list was Milo. Milo James Harris; Abigail and Milo.

I'd recommend Henry, too, if you like alliteration.

A name that shot to the top of my list after Henry was born is Simon. Simon James Harris; Abigail and Simon.

Another is Everett. I think it's so handsome with your surname. Everett James Harris; Abigail and Everett.

I do love the name Isaac, if you want to consider it more. Nicknames could be Ike or Zack. Isaac James Harris; Abigail and Isaac; Abby and Zack.

I know a sibling set of Abigail and Owen, and I've thought of it as a very good combination. Owen James Harris; Abigail and Owen.

Are there any other men from your side of the family who would make good namesakes? Maybe one of your grandfathers or uncles? It's so disappointing to have a good namesake name all set to go and then have it ruined!

Baby Girl F-urn

2011-12-27T06:41:00.002-06:00

Courtney writes:

My husband and I need help naming our first child, a baby girl, who is due to arrive at the very beginning of April. I'm Courtney and his name is Joel with the last name of F-urn (but it's spelled like the plant). We cannot agree on any sort of name. We plan on having 3-4 kids, so the thought of naming a sibling is in my head. I love older names (Charlotte) and he loves extremely popular names right now (Sophia and Olivia). One of the problems comes in because I teach high school and I have MANY students who I would never want to name my child after (which is why I am adamantly against Olivia). I love the idea of using family names but between the two of us, the only decent family name is Elizabeth, which is my middle name. Right now I am leaning towards Elizabeth as a middle name because everything seems to go with it and because of the family connection. I am Southern so I am definitely open to the double name; my husband also likes the double names except it seems that everything is paired with Beth. I want to stray away from all the Kaleeys, Baileys, etc. I want a name that is decidedly feminine (no gender neutral names or anything with a gender neutral nickname). One of our other requirements is that it is 2 syllables, since we have a 1 syllable last name. Our favorite name is Lily, but there is no way we could ever name our daughter Lily Fern (as a teacher I would laugh out loud seeing that on a roster).

His choices:
Olivia
Sophia (and call her Sophie)

My choices: (I really like the letter C in case you can't tell)
Charlotte
Caroline (this is lower on my list)
Cecilia
Chloe
Claire (although it only has 1 syllable and he veotes it because it's the name of a Kardashian)
Emma (but it is SO popular right now with little girls)

My hesitation comes in giving my daughter the same initials I have and I don't want to name my child after myself (which is what my husband's sister did). I prefer to not be in the top 10 names, but it seems like the styles we like are all on the top 10 list. I feel like I've searched through every website and and every book (including the Baby Name Wizard, which I know you recommend). I'm hoping you and your readers can offer some help!

Thanks so much!!

I am a little embarrassed to have Kardashian trivia easily at hand, but there it is: you have a subscription to People magazine, you pick up on certain things. I don't think there are any Kardashians named Claire (or as they'd certainly spell it, Klaire). There is, however, a Chloe, which they spell Khloé. (The others are Kourtney, Kim, Kendell, Kylie, and Casey who must feel quite left out, but Kris didn't name her so what can you do.)

So that would put Claire back on your list, except I agree it's choppy with the one-syllable surname. Instead I suggest Clara. Clara Elizabeth F-urn. I think sharing your initials and middle name is sweet, without being very noticeable or seeming like an obvious namesake.

You're right, Emma is very popular. Gemma, however, is not. Gemma Elizabeth F-urn.

Because you have Cecilia, I'll suggest Cecily. Cecily Elizabeth F-urn.

Cecilia also makes me think of Felicity. It depends on how you feel about alliteration, but I think Felicity F-urn is pleasingly whimsical without overdoing it.

The suggestion of Sophia always makes me think of Fiona, because of the similar sounds. Then Fiona and Sophia make me think of Bianca, because that's another one with a similar rhythm. Fiona again depends on how you feel about alliteration.

A less common version of Olivia is Liviana. It gives you the nickname Livvie---similar to your favorite Lily but without the botanical association.

Another name with a similar sound is Lydia. The nickname Liddy is again reminiscent of Lily.

Another name with a good strong V sound is Genevieve.

Mulling over Sophia and Olivia brought Sabrina to mind. Sabrina F-urn.

If your favorite name is Lily, I wonder if you would like Milly. It can be short for Amelia, Camilla, or Emeline, all of which seem compatible with the other names on your list.

Or Lila. I'd caution that I think Lila along with its alternate spellings is heading for the Top Ten---but many names look as if they're heading that way before hovering nicely in the non-top-ten Top Fifty.

Or Jillian, with the nicknames Jill and Jilly.

Or Willa is so pretty. Willa F-urn.

Another goes-with-almost-everything middle name I like is Louise, especially since then it gives you Lou for nicknames. Gemma Louise becomes Gemma-Lou; Clara Louise becomes Clara-Lou; Lydia Louise becomes Liddy-Lou.

Baby Naming Issue: Names With Negative Word Meanings

2011-12-23T08:29:00.003-06:00

Emily writes:

I absolutely adore your blog and can't get enough of baby name talk. An issue has been bothering me for a while and I'd love to hear what you/your readers think. One of my favorite names is Rue. This would be a nickname (everyday use) for Ruby which was the name of the beloved matriarch of our family. I love everything about it: the meaning of the full name, how cute it is as a call name and the rarity of it. However, by definition Rue means regret. It's not often used anymore except in literature, but is that negative meaning enough to ruin the name? Does the full name "Ruby" cancel out that meaning?

Just wondering if you have thoughts on the issue, or perhaps other examples with a similar problem.

Thanks for your time!

Ah! Yes! I am interested in this topic too. I am trying to remember when it recently came up. Oh, I remember: I love the names Malcolm and Mallory---but Mal means bad, and I took Latin.

I don't put much stock in baby name meanings---for example, that Emma means "healer of the universe" or that Isaac means "she laughed." I give it about as much thought as I'd give to flower meanings if Paul brought me a bouquet. ("Bachelor buttons?? Why didn't he just TELL me he wanted a divorce?? And why did I marry someone whose name means SMALL?") Different baby name books will give completely different meanings for the same name; and some names are retroactively given meanings from religious or mythological sources, but what did the name mean before then?

But when it's a WORD meaning, I get more involved. Rue. Mal. Bella. Patience. Hunter. I might still use one, but I'd consider the issue carefully.

One question is how familiar the word is as a name. We know a lily is a flower, and that gives the name Lily a pleasant floral imagery---but we're very familiar with it as a name. It's different if we meet a little girl named Sunflower, or Sapphire.

Another question is how familiar the name is as a word. The name Patience immediately brings the word patience to mind, but we don't use the word "felicitations" anymore so might not think of it with the name Felicity. Most of us might know that "bella" is the word for beautiful in Italy---but it's not the word for beautiful in the U.S. We might know the name Cooper is a tradesman name, but most of us would be hard-pressed to come up with barrel-making; Archer and Sailor are more evocative.

In the case of Ruby/Rue, I think you're in the clear. As you point out, we don't use the word rue much anymore (Paul and I still say it because of a Penny Arcade comic strip, but we don't say it MUCH). And we're somewhat familiar with it as a name, and I suspect we'll be even more familiar with it as this generation of Ruth/Ruby babies grow up. And as you also point out, it would be a nickname rather than the given name: naming a boy Malcolm is different than going straight to Mal; naming a girl Isabella is different than going straight to Bella. And it's an honor/namesake name, which gives it a new meaning related to your beloved family matriarch, which I'd say trumps other meanings.

You could also consider spelling it Ru.

Baby Naming Issue: Andromeda or Andi?

2011-12-22T08:11:00.005-06:00

Jolene writes:

I've been following your blog for a while, and have really enjoyed the baby name advice you've provided to others... so I figured I'd give it a go and ask you our question. We are expecting our first child any day now (Due date Dec 20) and are having some trouble deciding on a Girl's Name. (We still don't know the sex, boys names aren't quite so contentious... we both agreed on Malcolm Marshall without too much arguing)

Our last name is kind of long... sounds like "Donaldson". Before getting married I had a fairly short name (2 syllables first name, 2 syllables last name) so I'm a bit intimidated by the length of our last name in pairing it with other names.

My husband is in LOVE with the name "Andromeda" for a girl, and maybe using the nickname "Andi" for everyday. I do like the name, but I wonder if it's too much of a handle for a teeny little girl - it's really long, and uncommon where we live. When she grows up, she could use a shortened form - like Andi, Romi, Meda, etc - but I wonder if we might not be better off to use the nickname right from the beginning. I really love the name Andi, and it fits well with my own middle name.

My proposal is Andi Lynn "Donaldson"... but the husband is insisting that it must be Andromeda Lynn "Donaldson" and still call her Andi everyday.

Are we asking for trouble with such a long name? If we plan on using the nickname every day, is it better to just have that be her legal name?

Thank you for your time :)

In some cases, I like a more formal/serious given name to fall back on. In other cases, it seems silly to force a formal name that will never be used. In general, I lean toward OPTIONS, and so I lean toward formal names with nicknames, rather than nicknames-as-given-names. But it has to be case-by-case, because there are so many issues to consider.

In this case, I am charmed by the father's love of the name, and I am persuaded by the easy nicknames. The name Andromeda is no longer than the name Elizabeth; and although Andromeda Donaldson would be a mouthful with all those D sounds, I see from your email address that the actual surname is a much nicer fit. It doesn't seem too long to me at all, especially with a short middle name.

If you're willing to go with Andromeda, and if you don't think it will cause you problems later when choosing sibling names, I vote for making it the given name, and then using Andi as an easy nickname for any community. Let's have a poll over to the right, to see what everyone else thinks. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Name update! Jolene writes:

Our little girl arrived on December 30, 2011 of course... And we decided to go with the name: Andromeda Lynn Richardson... But with a twist - were calling her Romy for short.

She's a sweet little girl, and though we're completely exhausted, things are finally starting to even out a bit as far as a routine goes.

Thanks to you and your readers for your opinions on the name. I'd be interested to know what the final tally was on the poll as well. We only had one person have a really negative reaction to the name (unfortunately my father in law) and he's saying that he wants to call her his "little Annie" instead of Romy. If they want to have that little thing between them maybe that's ok in the end? We'll deal with it as it comes I guess :)

Thanks again!

Baby Boy _____er, Brother to Sisters Tatum and Campbell

2011-12-22T07:31:00.003-06:00

Jen writes:

Hi Swistle!
Here we are, baby #3 and you would think we've never done this naming business before. But, we are stumped. I think that we could name a gaggle of girls, but now that we are faced with naming a boy, we are stuck. We have 2 girls, Tatum and Campbell. There was a short list when naming both girls, but the one name that kept creeping up during both of their births was Barrett. Any other names have long since been forgotten.
As we consider names, we definitely want something that isn't too popular. My husband and I are Jennifer and Jason, complete with my brother, another Jason and his sister, another Jennifer. I would love for my children to only be identified by their first names and not by their first names and the first initial of their last name like we all had to deal with throughout our lives. Since our girls names are more masculine, we want a boy's name that is different, but doesn't take on too much of a feminine quality. My husband is also beginning to fight for names that are more "normal" but I still want to stay away from popular. I guess we are trying to find a middle ground that might include a mainstream name, but not too mainstream.
Our last name is a verb that ends in -er, so most names with an -er ending are out. I am also not a fan of many of the -den names like Caden, Braden, Jaden and Brendan. Our family is oversaturated with biblical names including Samson, Samuel, Seth, Silas, Gabriel, Simon and Shadrach, so I'd like to avoid duplication of those. The only other semi-restriction we have on names is that we would like to avoid a name that lends itself easily to a nickname. While we still love Barrett for a boy, we are worried about him being called Barry. A name that could be shortened isn't out, but we'd have to consider it carefully.
We aren't set on a middle name yet, although we are considering both Jason and Brett. These aren't set in stone though because we are more concerned with figuring out the first name. The current list of names only includes names that I like and my husband is mostly indifferent about. Unfortunately, he hasn't brought any names to the table, so I'm stuck. My list includes: Cullen, Graham, Elliot, Griffin and Reed. If I could get past the popularity issue, I also like Landon, but in my mind, it's out because it's so common these days. Names that have been rejected include Jace, Stellan, Gage, Deacon, Atticus, and Slade.
Any suggestions you could provide would be greatly appreciated. Our boy is expected to arrive at the end of January and I'm starting to get a little nervous since we seem to be at a standstill.
Thanks!

Barrett sounds like a very good choice to me. It's unusual but not unheard-of, and I suspect you could avoid Barry (though he might one day choose it for himself). (I became more fond of the name Barry, too, after having a smart/cute/funny one as a co-worker.)

There's also Merritt, but with the sibling names I think it sounds too feminine. (I think it would be a great option if later on you have another girl. Beckett, too, would be a great name for a third girl.) (Now I'm getting really off-topic, but Jenson would be charming for a girl, if you liked the idea of combining your names---or you could say she was named for her aunt and her uncle! ...Okay, now I will get back to work.)

If you want to move slightly more mainstream but without losing the no-surname-initial-required thing you've got going so far, I suggest using surname names that have mainstream nicknames. Bennett, for example: it continues your surname theme, but with the mainstreame nickname Ben. Tatum, Campbell, and Bennett. (I realize this completely ignores your preference for non-nicknameable names, but I still think it might work as a compromise idea.)

On the topic of Ben, in school I had a classmate named Benton. Tatum, Campbell, and Benton.

Similar to Bennett/Ben is Nicholson/Nick. Again, it's a mainstream nickname with an unexpected full version. Tatum, Campbell, and Nicholson.

Another: Davis. He can use Dave if he wants to (though it was only in thinking of it with Bennett and Nicholson that I realized that was an option), but the name Davis is handsome and unusual and masculine. Tatum, Campbell, and Davis.

Another: Anderson. I don't think I'd use the nickname Andy, but it would be nice to have it available. Tatum, Campbell, and Anderson.

Or Edison, handsome AND smart, and with the potential nickname Ed if he wants it. Tatum, Campbell, and Edison.

Or Robinson, which gives you Rob. Tatum, Campbell, and Robinson.

Or Jacoby, the unusual surname version of the fully mainstream name Jacob. Tatum, Campbell, and Jacoby.

I wonder if you'd like Aidric? It has a familiar/traditional sound (Aiden/Eric), but it's uncommon. Tatum, Campbell, and Aidric.

Keaton is familiar but not overly common. Tatum, Campbell, and Keaton.

This would be such a good sibling group for an honor surname. Maybe an old family surname, for something both uncommon and familiar? Or the surname of a favorite author or scientist or actor?

We just recently discussed the name Lennox, so it's on my mind. Tatum, Campbell, and Lennox.

One of my favorite boy surname names is Lawson. Tatum, Campbell, and Lawson.

Another of my favorites is Lincoln. I love the nickname Linc, and its familiarity as a surname makes it feel more traditional/mainstream. Tatum, Campbell, and Lincoln.

Another is Sullivan, with the nickname Sully. Tatum, Campbell, and Sullivan.

I like Malcolm for you. It's unusual, it's all boy, and it ties the sibling names together with a subtle M theme. Tatum, Campbell, and Malcolm. Actually, now that I write it out, I think it might have too many sounds in common with Campbell.

I like Everett even better. It's similar to Elliot (I think in this sibling group, Elliot might be too feminine), it's boyish and surnamey, it's uncommon but familiar. Tatum, Campbell, and Everett.

Baby Girl or Boy Butcher

2011-12-21T08:53:00.002-06:00

Corrie writes:

Hi there, I’m PRAYING you can help. I’m due in six weeks but we don’t know the sex. My husband and I are sort of agreeing (ish) on names but I don’t feel like we’ve nailed it yet. Our surname is Butcher (bad times) – so girl names need to be really pretty and soft to counterbalance it (I quite like the old-fashioned names but with Butcher, it often sounds like a 99 year old woman so we have to be careful!) I also like the idea of giving a daughter my middle name, which is my mum’s maiden name (she gave it to me to continue the name as she’s an only child) – it’s Lane. The trouble is that the only names we actually agree on are so common and I’d love something a little bit less obvious.

GIRLS
We both like:

Lily Lane
Ella Lane

But they’re both so common…

My husband has vetoed:
Romilly (I LOVE this but he won’t budge)
Silvie
Elodie
Gracie

Names we can’t consider because of family: Evie, Amelie, Oliver, Sam, Louis, Maisie, Charlotte, Arabella, Max

BOYS
We both like good, solid names. I would LOVE to go with something more whimsical/trendy (Marlo, Auden etc) but there’s no way my husband will go for it. He wants something traditional. It’s just trying to get a balance between traditional but not too obvious. Er, I haven’t even got as far as the middle name for a boy…

We both like (ish):

Atticus (Atty for short) – I kind of love this – husband less so - but don’t think we’re brave enough to do it
Arthur (Arty) – this is my husband’s favourite but I’m just not feeling it enough; I don’t really like the nickname
Oscar – bit obvious
Teddy (full name Edward) – I love this but my husband isn’t keen – I think it’s adorable!
Fred/Freddie – both like this but it’s so obvious

My husband has vetoed:
Albert (Bertie for short)

I would really appreciate any guidance – I’ve been through a zillion books and just can’t seem to crack it!

Thank you

Another issue with both Lily and Ella is how much L they have with Lane. But this is less of an issue with a middle name it would be with a surname.

I'd like to recommend Ivy instead of Lily, but with Butcher it suddenly makes me think of I.V. needles.

Iris, maybe, instead? Iris Lane; Iris Butcher. Sweet and feminine, and reduces the L problem. In the U.S., it's significantly less popular than Lily and Ella---but I see in the U.K. stats it's barely an improvement.

I see Lydia has fallen there. It's so close to Lily, but now it's out of the Top 100. Lydia Lane is fun to say. But does it sound as good there as it does here, where it's rising?

This is one reason I am hesitant to give advice for any other country: names have so many associations, and it's hard to figure out the associations they'd have for another country. Those of us in the U.S. might make a suggestion that leaves you thinking "WHAT on EARTH are they TALKING about??"---or we might give positive/negative feedback that would only apply to a name used HERE and would be otherwise useless. Do we have any UK readers to lend a hand with this one?

Baby Naming Issue: All the Names We Like are Too Popular

2011-12-18T06:35:00.007-06:00

Liz writes:

My husband and I are expecting our first child in April. We didn't have any girl names picked out, but knew if it was a boy, his name would be Dominic. Of course we found out we're having a girl! We couldn't have it the easy way.

Our problem is that it seems all the names we like are too popular right now. We're talking Isabella (used to be my favorite), Sofia, Ava, Mia... all beautiful names, but they're everywhere! We're trying to find a name that's outside the top 50 girl names. By no means does it have to be totally obscure... just not super-trendy. We know that these lists change, so a name we pick now may be very popular in a couple years - but that's the risk we take.

We have a 3-syllable Italian last name that ends in "isi" and we like the more Latin or Italian sounding names, although that's not a must-have. As you can tell from our list above, we also like names that are definitely feminine. No disrespect to the female Dylans and Jordans of the world - it's just not our style for our baby.

Our possible middle names are all family-related. We'd like to use one of the following:

Marie or Mary
Catherine
Elizabeth or Beth
Jacquelyn
Carol

Can you help us? We would be forever grateful! Maybe we can name her "Swistle." ;)

I think the name Swistle goes best with Elizabeth: Swistle Elizabeth _____isi. I love it. Or maybe it's too much L?

There are a few ways to approach the issue of having popular tastes:

One is to say "Hang it!" and go ahead and use your favorite names. The number one name last year was Isabella, but so far there have only been two Isabellas total in all of my kids' classes combined (I'm including all five kids but thinking especially of the younger three, who were all born after Isabella was in the top 10). I think a bigger problem are the names that get popular in groups: in William's class last year there was a Kyle, a Kyler, and a Kylie. Or a class might have an Amelia, an Emilia, an Emma, and a Mia, which is more noticeable than a single Sophia.

A second approach, which could tie in to the first approach, is to choose a popular name, but choose one with a steadier popularity curve: something that never gets too UNpopular, instead of something that went from almost unheard-of to Top 10 in less than a decade: Elizabeth instead of Isabella, Anna instead of Ava. (And all of the names on your list are less risky than a total newcomer such as a Cadence or a Madison.)

A third approach is to think, "Having a less common name is worth selecting a name I like less." In that case I'd go to the charts, pull up the list of the Top 1000 for 2010, start at #50, and work my way down while jotting down possibilities. As you've already noticed, some of those names might be on their way up (you can search each name separately to make sure it's not going up like, for example, #364 in 2008, #204 in 2009, #52 in 2010), but it's different odds choosing a maybe-it-won't instead of an it-already-has.

A fourth approach, which could tie in to the third approach, is to find names that are similar to the popular ones: for example, Cleo instead of Chloe. This is risky: it's what leads to a Kyle and a Kyler and a Kylie, or to an Eleanor and an Ella and an Elizabeth all going by Ellie. But it can also pay off beautifully: maybe everyone is tired of Isabella, but Isadora and Annabel would strike them as fresh and different--having some of the elements that make everyone like Isabella, but not in a way that would make them the next big thing.

Because it sounds like your preference is to avoid the popular names, I'll lean toward the fourth way: finding names that are similar to the names you like, but less popular. Here's how I'd do your list (with an extra-thorough perusal of The Baby Name Wizard's section of Italian names), but "names that seem similar" is a very subjective category so this is just to give you the idea:

Instead of Isabella: Isadora, Annabel, Willa, Gabriella, Mirella, Marilena, Raffaella, Arabella, Cordelia, Elisabetta.

Instead of Sofia: Fiona, Phoebe, Bianca, Josefina, Josephine, Claudia, Lucia, Annika, Philomena.

Instead of Ava: Eva, Eve, Ada, Ivy, Elsa, Geneva.

Instead of Mia: Lia, Celia, Mila, Mira, Gia, Ria, Nina.

You probably want to save Dominic in case of a future boy, but Veronica or Danica or Annika might have a similar and appealing sound for a girl.

Baby Naming Issue: Are Adelaide and Emeline Too Similar?

2011-12-17T11:59:00.005-06:00

C. writes:

My husband and I are expecting a baby girl in February. We have the name Emeline picked out, in fact it's the only name in the running really. But what I've been wondering is if it's too matchy with my 1 year old daughters name, Adelaide. Maybe I'm just over-analyzing it, but when I was comparing the names syllable by syllable (of which they each have three, another way in which they 'match') they seem to have a lot of similarities.

Ad uh layd
Em uh liyn

So - Is it too much? Thanks in advance for your help!

Oh, we also plan on having other children, would the matchyness limit our choices quite a bit for names later on?

To me it sounds like a very nice coordinated fit. The main similarity, I think, is the three syllables with the emphasis on the first syllable. Sound-wise, they share an "uh-l" in the middle, but otherwise have nice differences: different starting/ending vowel sounds and different starting/ending consonants. It tempts me to think of other very nice coordinated fits (Genevieve, Meredith, Josephine, Vivian, Juliet, Lorelei, Cecily, Natalie, Lydia, Rosemary...) for future sisters. And yet I think they'd be fine without such coordination: Adelaide, Emeline, and Sophia. Adelaide, Emeline, and Clara. Adelaide, Emeline, and Violet. Adelaide, Emeline, and Charlotte. Adelaide, Emeline, and Louisa. Adelaide, Emeline, and Cordelia. Adelaide, Emeline, and Felicity. Adelaide, Emeline, and Camilla.

I think they're great together. Nice work!

What does everyone else think?

Name Updates!

2011-12-17T06:25:00.003-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl T (Rhymes with Kayla), Sister to Sebastien and Georgia!
Update on Baby Girl Sharp, Sister to Owen!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl _____ Sights Flemming-with-a-D, Sister to Gavin!

Baby Girl M_____, Sister to Samuel John

2011-12-15T08:21:00.006-06:00

Debbie writes:

I’ve only recently found your site and I’m so impressed with the thoughtfulness and creativity of the names you suggest. Please help!

Our baby girl is due in three weeks and my husband and I are stuck in a naming rut. It’s not that we disagree, but we are not completely in love with our list and nothing new seems to be jumping out at us. We like classic names that are preferably not extremely common or very unusual.

Our 2 year old son is named Samuel John, which I suppose is not uncommon. However, naming Samuel was easy as my husband had always had this name in the back of his mind (after his grandfather – another boy would be called Henry), but we are struggling to think of girl names that are both pretty and say ‘take me seriously’.

Our surname is relatively uncommon where we live, starts with M and has two syllables, like Halston and with possibly similar pronunciation issues (actually pronounced like ‘Hol’, but usually guessed incorrectly as ‘Hal’). We’d rather not use a name or nickname that rhymes with either pronunciation (eg: Holly or Callie). Our first names are Deborah and Michael.

Names that have been on the list:

Emilia (familiar sound yet we don’t know anyone with this name)

Eleanor (nn Ellie, which has a family connection)

Natalie/Natasha (for its Christmas DD connection, but don’t like nn Nat)

Evelyn (again Christmas with Eve or Evie as nn)

Jemima (not sure this works with our M surname)

Ashley (husband likes, nn Ash, I’m not completely sold on it)

Adeline (love this, nn Ada, but vetoed by husband)

Caitlin (nn Cate, too common?)

Names we like but have been used by close family/friends:

Amelia

Charlotte

Chloe

Eliza

Helena

Isabelle

Madeleine

Rachel

Mackenzie (this one is left of field given the rest of our list, but husband likes it. Has been used by a couple of friends).

Names considered and rejected:

F names like Freya, Frances, Felicity

Anything that sounds like Sam, such as Samara, Camilla, etc

As mentioned, names that sound like they rhyme with our surname.

At this stage I think we’d use Emilia as either a middle name or a first name (although I’m not sure about nicknames Emmy, Em or Milly with our surname). If we use it as first, for middle we’d probably try to find a short name in keeping with Samuel’s, perhaps something like Claire, Kate, Leah or Beth.

Samuel was early and this naming problem is starting to keep me awake at night, just when I need my sleep!

Thanks so much

Looking at your lists, what stands out to me is that you mostly like common names---but you're trying to avoid them, and this could be what's making you feel stuck. I'll try to gear my suggestions toward less-common options, but also it's fine to choose a very common name if you LIKE very common names. Common isn't what it used to be: even the top ten is not necessarily the kiss of death.

Emilia is not very common, but it feels significantly more common than it is because of all the Amelias and Emmas and Mias. And I agree with you that the nicknames are not ideal with your surname: so much M and L. I also agree with you about Jemima: that's a lot of M with your surname.

The name Emeline might just switch us from one frying pan to another, but I'm mentioning it anyway because of Madeleine on your can't-use list.

Caitlin and Ashley are finally on the way down after years of high popularity: their decades of commonness and huge number of spelling variations make them feel even more common than they were, and I think I would avoid them at this point--especially since they don't meet your classic/traditional preferences.

Instead of Ashley, I wonder if you'd like Audrey or Aubrey?

One of my favorite "pretty but serious" girl names is Genevieve. It has the Eve you like from Evelyn, and it's a nice old name. It might be a little rhymey with your surname, though.

Another of my favorites is Eloise, and it reminds me of Eliza and Helena and Evelyn and Eleanor from your list. As with Genevieve, the "ee" sound might be too rhymey with your surname.

I think Evelyn from your list is a very good option: it was leaping up the ranks for awhile there, but now it's had two years in a row at #39 so it might not get to the top ten.

Eleanor too seems like a very good choice. It has the popular Ellie nickname, and also has Nora if that suits her better.

I'd thought almost for sure that Natalie was going to make it to the top ten, but the last few years it's been hovering just outside it at 17, 13, 16, 14. I love Christmas names (more possibilities here), and think this is a great name option for you. The main (and possibly deal-breaking) downside is that I think Samuel's nickname may make the nickname Nat even more tempting to use. "Sam and Nat" is so catchy and natural.

Sasha would give you some of the sound of Natasha without the Nat issue.

Would you like the name Noelle instead? I'm not sure if that's too much L with the surname (and with Samuel), or if it's just the right amount to tie it nicely together. Sam and Noelle, so sweet.

Caroline is a sweet classic choice, and has "carol" to remind us of Christmas. Samuel and Caroline; Sam and...and there's the problem. I've heard of Carolines called Caro and Carrie, but it's not as easy a nickname as Sam.

Stella is sometimes used as a Christmas baby name because it means star. I think it's a perfect "pretty but serious" name. Again I'm not sure if the L is good with the surname or not. Sam and Stella is wonderful, as long as it wouldn't make you feel locked into using an S name for any future children. I love Stella Joy: Samuel John and Stella Joy.

Holly is out for the way it rhymes with your surname, but Ivy is great. Ivy Emilia M____; Sam and Ivy.

I see Chloe on your can't-use list, and I wonder if you'd like Cleo? It just reverses the vowel sounds, and yet it's far, far less common. I love the sound of Sam and Cleo.

Another of my favorite pretty-but-serious names is Josephine. Maybe Josephine Claire, or Josephine Cate, or Josephine Noelle, or Josephine Eve. Sam and Jo.

Another is Rose: it's become common as a middle name, but is rare and fresh as a first name. Rose Emilia; Sam and Rose.

Another is Clara. Sam and Clara.

Name update! Debbie writes:

I was so excited to read your thoughts on our list. It really helped narrow our focus. We still had a few options in mind, but when she arrived on Christmas day we knew she was Evelyn Clare. And it turns out that one of her great great grandmothers was named Eva, so there's a family connection there too! Thanks so much for your help!

Baby Girl Chaplin, Sister to Lennox Elizabeth

2011-12-11T06:18:00.006-06:00

Tessa writes:

Hi Swistle!
I read your blog religiously & never thought I would be writing you about my naming indecisiveness. I have kept baby name "lists" since I was 9 years old, but it is so much harder when it's permanent! I am 28 weeks pregnant with our second baby girl. My name is Tessa & my husband's name is Tyson. Our last name sounds like Chaplin. Our first daughter is Lennox Elizabeth, named after my husband's great grandmother's maiden name. We are having a very hard time deciding on which name to choose for our final child. Help!

Since Lennox is an honor name, we would love to continue that trend (but as the middle name instead). My great grandmother's maiden name is McKenzie, which works well as a baby girl's middle name. That much we have agreed upon. If we were to have a boy, our short list included: Miloh, Silas, Cohen & Atticus. Looking back, we probably would have the same naming conundrum if we were having a boy! As for our small list of first names for a girl, we have 4 names that we are completely deadlocked on. I seriously have no idea how to "give up" one on the list & it would be so much easier if someone (you!) would just give us that extra push for a solid front-runner.

With Lennox (nickname: Leni) having a masculine name for a girl, I feel like the the name list we had when we were pregnant the first time are too simple & "girly". So, our new list includes:

1. Palmer
2. Tatum
3. Piper
4. Clara

Palmer is my husband's favorite. Palmer McKenzie Chaplin. It is commonly a boy's name & I believe it compliments her sister: Lennox & Palmer. All of the opinions that I have sought out (on google, baby forums, ect) point all advice on staying far away from Palmer as a baby girl's name. Everything from teasing in school to it is the "ugliest name ever" have come up. Is sticking to a generally masculine name going to set my daughter up for cruelty later in life? (My name, Tessa, was very uncommon in the 80s & I still rarely meet anyone my age with it- but I embraced the individuality of it, rather than being envious of more popular names).

I am leaning toward Tatum. Tatum McKenzie Chaplin. I know that it has been in the Top 500 names for a decade, but I like that it is considered a unisex name. I love the nickname Tate- Leni & Tate. My husband associates this name to Tatum O'Neal & all of the negative stigma that comes along with her. The only question I pose with Tatum is: is it weird to have a Tessa, Tyson, Tatum.... and Lennox? We purposefully stayed away from "T" names the first time! What about having the exact same initials (TMC) as my husband?

Piper is an appealing name to both of us, but we fear that it is becoming too popular. Some days we think that it is a happy medium between Palmer & Tatum, but also don't want to feel like we have to "settle" just because it's common & "cute". Piper McKenzie Chaplin.

Clara is my grandmother's name & the only name that we have carried from our first pregnancy name list. We both love the name but it has never been #1. It is an honor name & it has significant meaning, but is it too simple because of Lennox's naming style? I am not sure if Lennox & Clara fits well as siblings.

We are definitely open to other suggestions. The name Wren was #5 & recently taken off our list. Our decision would be a lot easier if my husband or I could easily cross off any of these names, but we can't. I would really like to have a name picked out before the birth, for fear of having a nameless child for days after delivery! We kept Leni's name a surprise, even though we were 99.9% sure beforehand. With this being my last child (& juggling two childen under 2yrs old), I just want to have everything done by the time the baby gets here :) Please point us in the right direction!

I would take Clara off the list, which pains me because it's on my own list of top favorites. It's traditional and old-fashioned and entirely used for girls, and it's on its way up in popularity (#167 in 2010). It isn't that sibling names must coordinate, but the clash with Lennox (modern surname name used almost entirely for boys and not in the top 1000 for girls) is startling.

I think Palmer, Tatum, and Piper all work fine, but with downsides to each.

Palmer is the most similar to Lennox for female/male name usage; Tatum and Piper are both used mostly for girls. Palmer is also the most similar in popularity: not in the top 1000 for girls, while Tatum is #335 and Piper is #144. Palmer is also the best match in name style: it's another clear surname name, while Tatum and Piper now sound like first names. Because of its excellent coordination, I'd vote for Palmer---except that it doesn't have a good feminine nickname like Lennox does in Leni. For me, that would be a huge issue, and it balances the advantages of androgyny/surname coordination. In fact, after thinking it over awhile, for me it takes it off the list. (I don't have the same feminine-nickname requirement for Tatum and Piper, because both names are already predominately used for girls.)

I think it's fine to have three T names and one L name in the family, because the L child came first. But it does put a small strike against Tatum for me.

A mark against Piper is that it's even more common than Clara: #144 in 2010, and rising.

The name Campbell came to my mind. Like Lennox, it's a modern surname name; and like Lennox, it has a cute feminine nickname. Lennox and Campbell; Leni and Cammi.

Or Hollis. Lennox and Hollis; Leni and Holly.

Or Ellison. Lennox and Ellison; Leni and Ellie.

Or Winslow. Lennox and Winslow; Leni and Winnie. That's one of my favorites.

Or Merritt. Lennox and Merrit; Leni and Merrie.

Or Maguire. Lennox and Maguire; Leni and Maggie.

Or Hatcher. Lennox and Hatcher; Leni and Hattie.

Or Padgett, which for me falls into the category of "I know it's a girl's name so it doesn't need a girlish nickname." Lennox and Padgett.

McKenzie would also be a good first-name fit, despite its relative popularity. Not only are Lennox and McKenzie both modern surname names (McKenzie is comfortably a first name now, but your spelling reminds people of its surname origins), and both great-grandmother surnames, but they sound wonderful together, all crackly and crisp. Lennox and McKenzie! I love it. You could use McKenzie Clara, and each girl would have a great-grandmother-surname first name and a traditional feminine middle name. But it sounds like you have already considered this and prefer it in the middle name slot, so I mention this only for the fun of discussing it.

I also recommend the post Choosing Between Two Finalists, which can work for more than two. Part of that post recommends seeing how you feel about the results of a poll, so let's also have a poll over to the right for the original four candidates. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Name Updates!

2011-12-11T06:04:00.002-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl Ronhovdee!
Update on Baby Girl Northcutt, Sister to Reid and Jace!
Update on Baby Girl Foreman!
Update on Baby Girl Marsh, Sister to Owen and Eli!

Baby Girl 1-ord, Sister to Nathaniel and Zachary

2011-12-08T08:42:00.006-06:00

R. writes:

Hi-- Our last name is very "holy" and begins with an "L"!
I am 27 weeks pregnant and scheduled for my 3rd (and last) C-section on February 29th. We are super excited to be having a GIRL after 2 boys. The boys were relatively easy to name--my oldest is 7 and is Nathaniel ("Nate") Thomas 1-ord--with Thomas being my husband's middle name. The younger is 20 months--Zachary ("Zach" or more often "Zach-y") Harrison 1-ord--with Harrison being an honor name for my dad, Harry, who passed away while I was pregnant with Zach.

Compounding our naming dilemma is a series of issues that have come about with the early pregnancy scans (downs syndrome scare, heart defect scare, hair lip scare, etc.) which have all turned out OK so far but caused lots of stress for the first 24 weeks or so and kind of made me worry about naming this baby too soon. (I had 4 pregnancy losses between Nate and Zach as well). Also, my mother has been recently diagnosed with cancer and is undergoing chemo right now--causing another set of family stress issues and conflicted feelings about the joy I have in this pregnancy.

Our naming style: We both like longer first names with a nickname that we use every day--but we also use the 3 names (Zachary Harrison 1-ord or Nathaniel Thomas 1-ord) when either child is in trouble (so I have to imagine saying the name in a stern tone while the child is misbehaving!). I am German/Scottish and my husband is Italian/Swedish and so far we haven't been able to come up with any names that "go" with any of these thus our rather traditional "American" named boys. The only issue we had naming the boys was that I LOVE biblical boy names like Noah, Jonah, Josiah, Lucas etc. which, with the last name of "1-ord" really is just too much (Although both boys names do come up in the bible)! We have also chosen "family" or "honor" names for the 2 boys' middle names so I feel pressured to do the same for this one. The problem is that my mom is Kathleen--which I don't love as a middle--but that would be the most obvious choice. I do like Kathryn which is similar to how we changed my dad's name to Harrison as an honor name....I don't know how I feel about it at this point, but it is a possible middle name choice.

For this pregnancy I have made lists of girl names and then my husband shoots them down...he wants to use a name we had "picked" for the first baby that turned out to be Nate--but I don't like the name anymore and it feels dated and already "used up" so I am unwilling to even consider it at this point.

Names I have considered:
Emilia Kathryn--right now is my top contender. I would go with Mia or Mia Kate as a nn. My problem with it is that it is pretty popular--especially when you add in all of the Amelias and Mias...have not pitched to husband b/c I don't want to "lose" it as a name!
Bridget nn Britta or Gretchen nn Gretta--love both but husband does not like. Not sure about middle names with either
Tabitha--love, husband hates "Tabby" or "Tibby"
Daphne, Fiona, Felicity--can't come up with usable nn's for any of these with "1-ord"--husband doesn't like
Abrielle or Briella--like both, but not sure about "Ella" with 1-ord--no idea about middle names for either
Alice nn Ali--like the simplicity, but not convinced it is "the one"
Brynne, Bronwyn, Brynlyn, etc. I like the idea but not the execution of these
I like Quinn as a middle name but it kind of feels like it comes out of nowhere in terms of our naming style...

I don't want a super popular name and would like to stay out of the top 100 but it is not a deal breaker. We have never run into another Nate (mostly Nathan which I dislike as a nn) and we rarely hear of another Zach that is under the age of 12-15. Names we hear ALL THE TIME in our part of the US--and would like to avoid as names or nn's-- are: Abigail, Chloe, Lucy, Lily, Lila, Olivia, Kaylee, Kylee, Leah, Hailey, Hannah, Delaney, Isabella...I like these names and think they are cute, but they are in every daycare, preschool and primary classroom!

At this point I am at a loss--and, I keep thinking I have plenty of time to decide but we are getting a lot of pressure from family and friends regarding the name of this baby as Christmas approaches and I have a baby shower scheduled for January 14th that I would like to have personalized (if possible)! As a side note, I am an only child and my husband's sister has no children so we have the only grandkids in the family....first and last grand-daughter comes with some pressure!

Help!

Does your mother go by Kate? That would make such a good middle name, though perhaps not with 1-ord. Or just changing the dated-sounding -een to a current -in sound might help: Kathlin is pretty. Also, Kathleen is how the U.S. initially translated the Irish name spelled Caitlin (which is pronounced more like Kathleen)---but since then we've also adopted the pronunciation KATE-lin for Caitlin. You could use Caitlin as a middle name, if you think your mother would feel honored by it.

But that's always my sticking point with changing honor names: DO people feel honored, when it isn't their name? It seems like it's a double issue: first, it implies their name wasn't liked enough to use; and second, they might not feel honored by a name that doesn't feel like theirs. But people vary hugely on this, and some people are honored if even their initial is used, so this will depend on how things are in your own family and with your own mother. It helps that you've been through this already with your dad's name, and have had a chance to notice your family's (and especially your mother's) reaction to an altered namesake name.

I am in favor of leaving it Kathleen: I think over time it will grow on you, especially if -een names make their expected comeback in the next generation or two. (Little aside: my mother considered giving me the middle name Grace after her grandmother, but couldn't stand to give me such an ugly name. A generation later, here it is sounding lovely again and I would love to have it.) And I love middle names that add to the nickname possibilities: just as with Kathryn, Kathleen gives you Kate to pair with the first name.

Or, you could drop the idea of an honor name. It's fairly common for families to run out of honor names they want to use, and also for families to prefer a different naming style for the girls than for the boys.

If you like Emilia but it's too common, I suggest Emeline. (I'm thinking of the emma-LINE pronunciation rather than emma-LEEN.) Emeline Kathleen 1-ord, or Emmie Kate, or Emma Kate.

Or Anneliese? It's German, and pretty, and I like it with the brother names: Nathaniel, Zachary, and Anneliese; Nate, Zach, and Annie.

Would your husband prefer Margaret over Gretchen? You could still use Greta, but it also opens up the possibilities of Meg, Maggie, Daisy, etc. Margaret Kathleen 1-ord. DAISY KATE. Maggie Kate. I love this name. I want it for myself.

Instead of Tabitha, would you like Agatha or Meredith or Meribeth or Bethany? I love Meredith 1-ord. Meredith Kathleen 1-ord, Merrie Kate.

Emilia and Briella make me think of Camilla. Camilla Kathleen 1-ord; Millie Kate or Cammie Kate. Same possible issue with the surname as Briella, though: a little bit of a ill-la-la with the surname.

Baby Naming Issue: Using the Namesake Name of Someone Who Hated Her Name

2011-12-07T19:11:00.001-06:00

Beth writes:

My friend Jenny suggested we email you guys because we are having serious naming problems.

The parameters:

*Our last name starts with M and is too short to support an M name.

*We don't know the gender

*We are small people and while we are great runners and in good shape I'm pretty sure this kid is going to be a bit of a nerd, and small and if it's like me at all, lack all hand-eye coordination. So if it is a boy we'd like to avoid names that rhyme with jerk or can be made into horrible rhymes.

*We either want the middle name Rae or Ray for my paternal grandmother or something after my mom but here's the thing - my mom, who died a few years ago, was named Bernice. But she hated her name. She once tried to change it at camp and wandered off when everyone was screaming JUNE! because she forgot she had changed her name.

*For boy names we like names that end in -en or -an and we love old fashioned names that have awesome nicknames (Sebastian, with Baz as the nickname, is a contender)

*We like old fashioned girl names too, and we have a few. Boy names are way harder for some reason

*But here's the biggest problem. Because of what I do, I can't actually come "out" to a lot of people - I'm not like in the military or anything. So it is really just me, my husband and my pregnant insomnia working overtime.

Thanks! And in the interim thank you for having the site which is perfect for reading over 3 am peanut butter.

The mother-namesake dilemma has seized my attention, so let's start with that. I know from previous posts on this subject that we as a group have mixed feelings about using a honor name when the person-to-be-honored hated the name. My own opinion is that there's a difference between hating one's own name and not wanting it used for a namesake---but that this is why we have to apply such things on a case-by-case basis. There are people who would be indignant and upset if you used their hated name on a baby, and there are people who would be even more deeply honored that you loved them enough to use the name they think would be a challenge to use. (It's one thing to name a baby after your Grandma Grace when the name Grace is fully in style, and another thing entirely to name a baby after your Grandma Earline when the name Earline is not.) There are people who would say grouchily "I don't know why you'd want to give a name like mine to a baby!" and continue saying it every time they saw you, and there are people who would find they loved their own name more after seeing it on a sweet little baby.

In the case of your mom's name, you'll have to guess. Or since she is not here to care one way or another if her name is used, you could consider what the other people in your family will think about it: will they think, shocked, "But Bernice always HATED her name!!" or will they think "Oh, how nice!" Or you can consider how you personally will think of it: will you wince thinking of how she hated her name, or will it bring to mind only your mother herself?

If you decide not to use her name, there are many interesting options to consider.

1. Would her middle name or her maiden name work?

2. Use June: she WISHED it were her name. Or any other name she repeatedly mentioned as a name she'd rather have had.

3. Are there any names she repeatedly said she wished she'd used on a child, or did she ever mention she'd love to have a grandchild named ____?

4. Did she have a nickname she went by, something that could be used as a name?

5. I see in The Oxford Dictionary of First Names that a nickname for Bernice is Binnie. That's adorable.

6. I think it's reaching to use names that "have the same meaning" as the name in question, but it's a fairly common practice. Bernice means "she who brings victory"; other names with similar meanings (according to Baby Names Made Easy) are Colette, Jaia, Jocelyn, Nicole, Veronica, Victoria. But would any of those bring your mother to your mind?

7. I also think it's reaching to do "same first initial" namesakes---but again, it's fairly common practice. Any B name would fit this. But again: would any of those bring your mother to your mind?

8. Now I will REALLY reach, because we're here anyway: could you use your mom's birthstone, or birth month, or birth month flower? Would anything special to her (a collection, a favorite saint, a favorite location, a favorite flower) work as a name?

9. Do you have another honor name you'd like to use that could be combined with Bernice? For example, if your husband's mother was named Jeannine, you might be able to pull off a Jennice sort of thing.

I think if it were me and if it were my mom, I would use her name in the middle name slot as-is. Everyone else would know what I meant by it, even if my mom had always hated her name (it's not like anyone would think I was intending anything but an affectionate honor), and also I know my own mom would be pleased by the honor even if she didn't like the name---just as she'd likely be pleased if I kept a framed photo of her, even if she'd never liked the way she looked. And besides, she wouldn't be here to mind anymore, so I'd be using the name for my own sentimental reasons and to be reminded of her and to let my daughter have something belonging to the grandmother she didn't get a chance to know. Using Veronica or Bridget wouldn't give me any of those same things, just as framing a photo of someone else's mother wouldn't be a workaround.

I just had one more idea. I'm not sure I can think of any good examples that work, and we might need to make up some names, but I kind of love the concept: we'd HIDE your mom's name within your daughter's name. Like this: Ember Nicelle. September Nicelle. Berni Cecile. Aubern Icene. Main problem: pretty much NOTHING ends with -bern or starts with Nice-, and certainly nothing old-fashioned, and I totally had to make up and/or misspell names to get even a few unlikely examples. We could start playing with spelling, but then it's like all those kids named Naveah and Neveah: it doesn't make sense if it doesn't have a hidden word in it anymore. Sigh. Well, I suppose the idea is a bust, but it might work for other people trying to use a name in similar circumstances.

I will tear myself away from this topic and turn my attention to the other issue. An old-fashioned boy name, not starting with M, ideally ending with -n, ideally appropriate for a small-framed nerdy type, with good nicknames. Hm. I came up pretty dry on that, but we will hope the commenters have more success.

Alexander (Alex, Zan, Xander)
Augustus (Gus)
Benjamin (Ben)
Calvin (Cal)
Ezekiel (Zeke)
Judah (Jude)
Leopold (Leo)
Nathaniel (Nate)
Solomon (Sol)
Theodore (Theo)
Wilson (Will)

I think your choice of Sebastian/Baz is best, though I am also partial to Wilson/Will and Augustus/Gus and Calvin/Cal.

Hurry, Hurry, Babies Already Born! Baby Twin Boys Darling, Brothers to Charlie

2011-12-04T15:37:00.003-06:00

K. writes:

I really enjoy reading your blog and hope you can help make some good suggestions for us. This February we are expecting twin boys. Total shock for us but super excited about it. My husband and I have a fair amount of names that we like, but can't seem to agree on a solid pair of names that we just love. I would describe our taste in names as traditional with a strong pull towards names that are Irish/English sounding. We dislike strongly names that sound made up (like your Caydens and Neveahs), nature sounding names (no Willows or Ivys please) and anything super trendy. Our last name rhymes with Darling and we have an older son named Charles (we call him Charlie). Had Charlie been a girl, he would have been Nora, Claire or Mary Kate. Here is a list of what we're working with so far:

Brendan -like
Thomas -love nn Tommy
Eamon- my personal fav, husband not sold on yet.
Peter-husband hates, I like
Liam-husband likes, I don't
Andrew-husband likes, too popular for me, but I think Andy is cute nn.
John-like
Quinn-like but worried might be more of a girls name/ gender neutral name
Graham-almost used instead of Charlie, but now my MIL wishes to be called Gram so for me it's out.

Names we can not use because friends and family have used them recently: Henry, Jack, Connor, Colin, William, Michael, Kevin.

We are not so worried about middle names for now.

We want the pair to sound nice together and flow well with Charlie. I am not sure if I love or hate the idea of twin names that are matchy-matchy. For example Timmy and Tommy are cute together for a minute, but I fear after awhile it would sound a little too sugary sweet. I feel like we are on the right track but just kind of stuck on ideas. Interested in your suggestions, Swistle. Thanks for your help!

and

My boys were born yesterday, very early, and are twin a and twin b for now.

Congratulations on your two new sons.

I am in favor of slight extra-coordination for twin names. With my own twins, I was hoping for a small connection such as same first initial, or reverse first-middle initials (for example, one J.E. and the other E.J.), or same number of letters, or repeating sounds (Emily and Liane was one of my favorite girl-twin combinations, for the same number of letters and the repeating "lee" sound), or similar endings, or initials A and B for twins A and B, or anything like that. It happened that the two names we liked best had nothing in common at all, and I am still a little sorry about that.

Working with your list, here are my favorite combinations:

Peter and Thomas; Pete and Tom
Eamon and Liam
Thomas and Andrew; Tommy and Andy (same number letters/syllables for 1st names)
Liam and John (same number of letters)
Andrew and Brendan (share the -an-, and also are A and B initials)

Along with John, James is one of my favorite classic/traditional names. James would go nicely with some of the other names on your list. Thomas and James would give you Tommy and Jimmy, which is significantly less matchy than Tommy and Timmy, while still giving a pleasing additional level of coordination.

It seems to me that Daniel would fit in well with the rest of your list. I think the nickname Dan sounds like such a nice guy.

Daniel and Thomas; Dan and Tom
Daniel and Andrew; Dan and Andy (repeating sounds/letters)
Daniel and Brendan (both have "dan")
Daniel and Benjamin; Dan and Ben

If Andrew is too common, would you like Anderson? You'd still have the nickname Andy.

To go completely off-list, I like the idea of combining two of the boy names in the longer-names-with-short-nicknames category (and I love it extra when the nicknames also have the same number of letters!) (I know, but I just DO love that kind of thing. I also love Christmassy names at Christmastime):

Benjamin and Jonathan; Ben and Jon
Nathanial and Nicholas; Nate and Nick
Nicholas and Christopher; Nick and Chris (subtle Christmas theme)
Anderson and Harrison; Andy and Harry
Alexander and Nicholas; Alex and Nick
Theodore and Alexander; Theo and Alex
Alexander and Benjamin; Alex and Ben (twins A and B)
Anderson and Benjamin; Andy and Ben (twins A and B)

Malcolm and Callum are names that are similar to Liam, and may have too MANY sounds in common---but maybe not. Mal and Cal are probably too cute---but maybe not.

Callum and Liam also share many sounds, without having possibly-overly-coordinated nicknames.

Davis and Harris would make a nice set: matching endings, and yet the names are so different.

Elliot and Miles go together nicely without matching.

Miles and James share the same number of letters and the same ending. Is that too many -es boys for your family, or is it an additional plus?

If your husband is not quite sold on Eamon, I wonder if he would prefer Ian or Owen or Evan or Ethan?

I love Owen with Liam.

Ian is one of my favorites, but I'm not sure what to pair it with. Ian and James? Ian and Eli? Ooo, that's kind of fun, to be three letters together! Charles, Eli, and Ian?

Ian and Leo might be better because they have the 3-letter thing but they don't share as many sounds. Charles, Ian, and Leo. I love that.

Ian and Isaac would give you matching initials but with non-matchy sounds.

John and Isaac are nice together without being matchy.

Simon and Isaac share the same number of letters, and also that nice strong I-sound.

Simon and Oliver are nice together without being matchy.

Elliot and Oliver share the same number of letters and syllables, as well as the L-sound, and I love how they also tie in to the L-sound of Charles.

Oliver and Jasper share the same number of letters and also the -er ending.

Asher and Felix don't quite seem like they'd fit in with your style, but both of them mean lucky.

Isaac mans "she laughed," and I think the implication of surprised delight (the meaning comes from the Bible, where a woman barren and now also post-menopausal finds out she's pregnant at last) makes it a particularly good name for an unexpected child: it would make a good name for the second twin, since he was the surprise.

Felix and Isaac share the same number of letters and mean, respectively, luck and surprised delight. It's a nice combination for twins.

Asher and Bennett have good meanings (lucky and blessed), and also work nicely for twins A and B. (Plus, as with all the other A&B combinations, your children's initials would be A, B, and C. But I don't recommend this if it would make you feel pressured to continue it with the next child.)

Two of my favorite Celtic names are Declan and Cormac. Dec and Mac are adorable nicknames.

Some of these pairings might also make a nice first-middle combinations: Isaac Simon. Asher Bennett. Oliver Simon. Miles Elliot. Oliver Elliot. Ian James. Etc.

Since you don't have particular middle names in mind, I love the idea of using one twin's first initial as the other twin's middle initial. So for example, if you went with Andrew and Brendan, it would be fun to name them Andrew Bennett and Brendan Asher (if those initials don't spell anything awkward with the surname). Or Nicholas and Christopher could be Nicholas Cormac and Christopher Nathan. Or Ian and Leo could be Ian Lachlan and Leo Isaac.

Baby Girl You-dell

2011-12-02T09:49:00.007-06:00

Erin writes:

I have been following and commenting on your blog for many years now (before I was married even), and here I am finally writing to you and your readers for help with an actual baby! (a book, sorry about that, feel free to edit)! I am Erin, my husband is Brian, and our last name sounds like you-dell (accent on the dell). We chose our last name together as a mixture of our surnames but didn’t realize how it would limit us from almost all french baby names ending in L, many of which I love (ie Noelle). This is our first baby, due in March, but we don’t know what we are having yet. We anticipate having two children, possibly three, but for naming purposes I am thinking of the sibling set in terms of two, as I’m fairly confident we can come up with a third we love if need be. Here are our lists:

Boy names we both agree on:
Griffin (he loves)
Everett (I love)
Owen (friends just named their son this, its extremely popular where we live but we both love)
Josiah (too old testament? The other three are pulling away from this candidate)

Girl names we both agree on:
Audrey (we both love and is current front runner, but I always wanted to stay away from girls names ending in y or ie for various freakonomics reasons - namely that those names give the impression of “least smart” according to the studies. Also, sometimes I have trouble with the Odd and the “DR” sound rolling off my tongue. Wondering if there will be confusion with all the Aubreys out there. Stylistically though, this is exactly what we are looking for).

Lilah (he loves more than me, we also have a dog named Lola - is it a little frilly to yell at her soccer game?)

Clara (he loves more than me, I find a bit frumpy in feel but love the acoustic value of it)

Eliza (I love more than him)

Genevieve (he loves, I have trouble with all the nn possibilities - and would hate if her name was shortened to Gen. I took Madeline off the list because of the Maddie nn, but I am hoping for an Eve or Evie/Eva nn out of Genevieve)

Claire (I love, this is my mothers middle name who I would like to honor and together with our last name Claire reminds me of my favorite classical piece, Clair De Lune - but he finds a bit plain so I am definitely willing to move to middle name spot)

Elizabeth (mostly because we both love Liz/Lizzie. My middle name is Elizabeth though, so it feels a bit narcissistic to use this as a first).

Sienna and Annika are also high on the list, but don’t match the others in style (they do seem to fit alright with eachother, though, I think).

To give you an idea of names we don’t agree on, here are a few of his:

boys:
Jameson
Evan
Holden

Girls:
Eva
Naomi
Alexandria
Teagan
Mackenzie

and mine:
boys:
Grant

girls:
Mia
Colette (LOVE, but he does not care for)

Names that are OUT (but we like):
Oliver
David
Timothy
John
Eric
Madeline
Leah
Lydia
Brianna
Catherine
Greta
Megan
Lauren
any elle names (adele, noelle, etc. because of our last name)
any names beginning with F (because the initials would be horrid)
any names ending in a ya sound, including names like Amelia and Cecilia (because when said fast, you get a ya-ya effect with our last name).

For middles we would like to honor family. for girls the middle will be Claire if the first is not Clara or Claire after my mom, and for boys we are working with Curtis, Gerard, Emory, and a host of other kind of blech names. Curtis or Gerard would be for my father however, and since we are closest to him, would be the best ones to use. My dad is a pretty laid back guy though, and wouldn’t care too much if he werent honored and my mom was.

Ready for a weird restriction? I can’t stand long A sounds, so names like Amy, Katie, Jane, Rachel etc. don’t really work. Same with boys (no Ames or Aiden or any of that). I truly get a bad taste in my mouth when I say long As, so I don’t want to have that every time I say my child’s name. I don’t even love short A sounds like Abigail or Alexandria but Ah sounds (like Annika and Audrey) are just fine. Have you ever heard of that before?

I would prefer shorter, one or no nickname names, but husband likes nn’s more. In a perfect world, the name would be of Irish, French or German origin, but we haven’t found a lot of those that we love that aren’t already on the list. I am tempted to name all my potential children (two boys, boy and girl, two girls) now and have it set going forward, but my mind has already changed so much since I’ve gotten pregnant, who knows where I will be in a few years. I do know that from our lists, we have a lot in the same categories that would work as sibling sets, so I am not as worried about that (if I have Sienna, I will probably opt for an Annika next, and if I have a Lilah, I will opt for a Clara or Audrey next - Elizabeth and Genevieve (Liz and Eve). Eliza works with almost all of them). Griffin and Owen or Everett and Audrey, there are combos that work. I am having a hard time imagining cradling my baby and calling him or her things, but I have been trying. My problem is I love all the names I will have to discard, and I can find something wrong with all of the names I have chosen after I say them over and over again. Will I ever be satisfied or know which one is THE ONE? Please help us narrow down our choices! New suggestions I am open to too, but I am sure I have already considered all the options, as I am a true name nerd! Sometimes,
though, it takes having someone else re-suggest it for you to really feel it, so I’d definitely reconsider other names!

In terms of popularity, I’d like to stay out of the top 10 or so, but if a name is classic and pretty popular (like Elizabeth) I am ok with that. I am a little afraid Lilah or Clara will be the next Emma, though, given the trajectories of the names. For whatever reason, I don’t have the same panic about picking boys names as I do girls names, and I can’t explain why. The girl name has to be perfect, whereas the boy name I just have to like well enough. I will be finding out what I am having in November and will update you then! Sorry for the book, I just really care about this! Thank you so much!

and

We are having a girl! Now that we know we can get down to business, although as excited as I am to get to name a daughter, I also feared it! She is our first baby, we may have 2-3 kids, but we can find things in similar styles that we like for a sibset. We thought we were settled on a name (Audrey Claire) but found out a cousin of my husband's who neither of us like just named her daughter that, which has soured us a bit. I think we were both looking for a reason out of the name too, if that makes sense - I didn't love that people would confuse it with Aubrey, and that it didn't have any nicknames, and the weight of the "OddR" sound, though I loved the style of the name.

Our current choice is Eliza Claire. A couple of questions about it - my middle name is Elizabeth, and my mother's middle name is Claire, so is Eliza Claire family name overkill? I don't want to seem narcissistic and name the baby after me, and while we considered Elizabeth for awhile, I think we've come down on the side that Elizabeth is too much mine and feels overused. On the other hand we like the spunk and freshness of Eliza, still feel connected to it, and feel as though it takes on a different style and personality than Elizabeth.

What I'd like to know is if you or your readers agree? One thing I still hear from people is that Eliza is not its own stand alone name, but a nickname for Elizabeth. Thoughts? Also, DH loves the nn Lizzie for when she is little and Liz or Liza Claire for later, do you think it will be difficult to get people to call her Lizzie when the vowel sounds are different from Eliza? Obviously, many Katherines go by Kate, but in this instance I wonder if its a bit weird. Last question, if I use all my favorite family girl names on this girl and have a future daughter, then what? Should I save one of the names just in case?

Our short list for girls is below, we will very likely choose something from this list if it is not Eliza or Audrey as we have been through every other name in the book a million times over, but feel free to suggest something else too. I have some odd restrictions in that I don't like long A sounds as in Ava or Kaylee, names that start
with a short A as in Abigail, names that end in "elle" sounds as in Adele and names that end with a "ya" sound, as in Cecilia for purposes of going with our last name. You have my names we cannot use list from the previous email too.

Top tier

Eliza Claire
Sienna Claire
Annika _____ (I'm reading that there are pronunciation issues with this one, I would pronounce it Ahn-i-ka, accent on the first syllable. Is that how you would?)
Lilah Claire
Genevieve Claire (Eve or Evie, possibly Genna)
Claire Alexandria

Still being considered:
Audrey Claire
Eva Claire
Clara ____

If this baby had been a boy, we were considering Grant, Everett, Griffin (top choice) and Owen.

This may be a request for reassurance more than a question, but hopefully you and/or your readers can help me feel confident in a name!

Thanks for your help!

I am first going to do a sweep through this whole thing, giving my answers to questions and commenting on major issues; this will help sort them for other opinions in the comments section as well.

1. I don't think Lilah seems too frilly to yell at a soccer game. I think one reason the name is getting so popular is that it seems right for many types of girls.

2. Yes, I've heard of people disliking certain sounds right across the board: short-A endings, K sounds, J sounds, B sounds, -den endings that are more like d'n, that sort of thing.

3. I think it's a little annoying of our culture to consider it perfectly natural to name a child after the father but not after the mother. But when it's the mother's middle name, and especially a variation on the mother's middle name, I think it's nearly a non-issue: most people won't even know.

4. Eliza is definitely a name in its own right.

5. I don't think Eliza Claire is family-name overkill. I think it's great.

6. A general warning about the middle name Claire is that it can change to "éclair" with some first names.

7. I don't think of Liz as a nickname for Eliza: the changed vowel sound is also what makes me feel like Eliza is not a natural nickname for Elizabeth, so that shows you how much weight you should give the opinion (especially since I am fine with Kate for Katherine and Meg for Margaret, Because It's Traditional). I'm sure you can use Liz or Lizzie if you want to; most people are not as conservative about nicknames as I am.

8. I definitely think of Eliza as a different style from Elizabeth, same as you do.

9. Saving names is a difficult issue. Because it's a gamble, it has to be treated that way: weighing on one side how disappointed you'd be if you didn't get a chance to use a favorite name, and on the other side how stressed you'd be to have used up the names and need to come up with a different plan. In this case, I'd be in favor of using both names, because you don't want to miss the chance to honor your mother. I'd feel differently if you were cramming in a ton of honor names, but this sounds more like you happen to want to use a name similar to your own middle name, and then you want to honor your mother. Since you're even a little uneasy about seeming as if you're honoring yourself, it seems more like one honor name and one sweet connection name.

10. Yes, I pronounce Annika ON-nicka. I have heard from other people that that they've encountered Annikas who pronounced it ANN-nicka, so both pronunciations are in use.

I think Eliza Claire is the best option. It gives you what you want, and it sounds as if you like it best. It also gives you the most flexibility with future sibling names, since you've mentioned you like it with almost all the other options. Eliza You-dell is a great name, and it's one I'd want for myself.

I also think you have a lot of other nice possibilities, if Eliza doesn't sit right. You've been reading me long enough to have heard me preaching against the concept of The One Perfect Name, but I do like to feel a sort of CLICK as a name settles into place. You may find that several names click nicely, and this can make it harder to decide---but it also means you have a nice group of names that would ALL work well. And if you regret letting a certain name go, perhaps you will have a chance to use it on a future child.

It IS hard to choose a name: the "forsaking all others" aspect is daunting, and I think it's inevitable that a baby name hobbyist will have some names she'll always regret not having been able to use. I find it helps to realize that EVERY name means letting go of all the others: there will be some sadness with EVERY name, and the task is to find the one you'd be saddest not to use. You might also find it useful to revisit Choosing Between Two Finalists (which also works for more than two finalists).

Name Updates!

2011-12-01T05:54:00.002-06:00

Update on Baby Girl Pinkerton, Sister to Celia Rose!
Update on Danish Baby Name Dilemma!
Update on Baby Naming Issues: Avoiding a "Teen Mother"-Sounding Name; Non-Coupled Parents Working Together to Choose a Name!

Baby Girl Math-E, Sister to Isla Juliet

2011-11-29T16:59:00.005-06:00

Jacquelyn writes:

We need your help! Our second daughter, and most-likely last child, is set to arrive this March, and we are going in circles trying to name her. Our first daughter is Isla Juliet, last name sounds like Math-E. Although we didn't foresee Isla becoming as popular as it has, we continue to adore it. It falls in the short and sweet category that we prefer, and feels feminine and spunky at the same time. We would like to give this baby a moniker with similar qualities, yet not projected to skyrocket the charts as her sister's did. We are confident that the perfect name is waiting to be unearthed...and you can help us do that!

There are several names that have been on and off of our list, including Lucia, Eva, Cora, and my husband's all time favorite, Alba. We may be willing to reconsider these, but for some reason or another, they just aren't feeling "right."

As it stands, two names - and two names only - continue to be in the running:

Thea
Eleanor

We like both names well enough, but have found problems with each. With Thea, we worry that that the repeating "thee" sound in our first and last names is too much. And while Eleanor is our top contender at this point, we only like the name as a whole. Is the ever-popular Ellie inevitable? Is Eleanor destined to be uber-popular? When it comes down to it, we feel that there could be a better choice out there that we just haven't come across.

I should also mention that we have yet to choose a middle name, but will be keeping with family tradition and giving our daughter a "J" name like my husband and his brothers', mine and my sisters', and our daughter's middle. So any suggestions there, while certainly not expected, would be of great help.

Thank you for taking the time to read our naming dilemma. We are grateful for your insight, and your opinions are highly valued and so very appreciated.

I do think Thea Math-ee is too much ee and th.

Eleanor is rising steadily. In the 1980s, it was in the 600s. In the 1990s, it was in the 500s and 400s. In the first decade, it was in the 300s and 200s. And in 2010, it was #165. It's not racing up the charts, but it's going at a nice brisk walk.

But I wouldn't necessarily let popularity rule out the name. For one thing, it's hard to know how many little Eleanors will be called Eleanor. Many parents are choosing it as a way to get the nickname Ellie, and others are choosing it as a way to get the nickname Nora (which I'd be recommending to you because of its similarity to Thea/Isla/Cora, except it's rising even faster than Eleanor). I do think it's easier now to prevent people from using nicknames you don't want them to use---but of course she might get older and choose a nickname for herself.

I wonder if a name like Linnea would appeal? Linnea and Eleanor share similar sounds, but Linnea ends up with a lighter touch---more like Isla. Isla and Linnea.

Linnea makes me think of Fiona. Isla and Fiona.

Fiona reminds me of Bianca, a name that's approximately the same popularity but falling instead of rising.

I see that one of my mom's favorite names is in The Baby Name Wizard as a sister name for Isla: Esme.

I think Audra has some of the rich sounds of Thea and Eleanor. Isla and Audra.

Instead of Thea, would you like Bria or Cleo or Delia or Freya or Gia or Mira or Opal?

You've probably spent a good deal of time in the J names already, but a few of my favorites are:

Jane
Jean
Jillian
Jo
Jolie
Josephine
Joy
June
Junia
Juniper

Baby Girl Garnet, Sister to Brendan and Bridget

2011-11-24T09:46:00.004-06:00

B. writes:

I never thought I'd need baby name advice, but here I am. I have a 4 year old son, and a less than one year old daughter and I am unexpectedly pregnant with baby #3 (definitely the last) due in April 2012. Our last name rhymes with Garnet (emphasis on first syllable). My son is named Brendan and my daughter is Bridget. We didn't necessarily plan on two names with Br- but we didn't see it as problematic either. They were names we both loved and had family connections.

Middle name: Probably going to be Maria in honor of my mother-in-law. Less concerned with it working with middle as I am with last.

Names we've considered:

Brynn (I like, husband doesn't, and is it too cute to have three names have Br- starts?)
Fiona (husband loves, not sure I do. Shrek association?)
Bevin (I like, husband doesn't)
Ellen (I don't love, maybe variations? Kind of like Ellie as a NN)
Nora (probably out because of negative family association)
Maeve (probably out because of negative family association)

Names that are out (due to use by family): Claire, Kayleigh, most anything ending in -een (Maureen, Eileen, Kathleen, etc.), Meaghan, Catherine. I generally don't love the idea of a hugely popular / trendy girl name (there goes Ava, Olivia, Emma, etc.) Husband likes Isabella. Feels far too popular/trendy for me. As you can see, we (generally) like Irish sounding names, but my husband balks at the more traditional names with spellings that don't "match" the pronunciation (see, e.g, Aisling, Aoife, Niamh) -- though I've advocated a phonetic variation like Neve.

I could really use some fresh suggestions and a new perspective.

Thanks!

I think I might not do a third Br- name in a row (I wouldn't rule it out, either, but it's a very distinctive theme so I'd want to be sure it was what I wanted), but I think I WOULD be hoping to find a B name I liked: a B name would keep the third child from standing out, but would also keep the theme from seeming too forced/cute. Some possibilities:

Brendan, Bridget, and Beatrix
Brendan, Bridget, and Bethany
Brendan, Bridget, and Bianca (similar to Fiona, but no ogre)

The trouble is, a LOT of good girl B names are Br. If you do go that route, I'd look for ones that have a distinctively different sound (i.e., not Brenna because it's so close to the Bren of Brendan; not Brecken because it shares not only the Br but also the short-E and the N-ending of Brendan). I've put Brinley on the list because the -ley adds such a different sound---but the short-I and the N might make it too close to the Bren of Brendan and the Brih of Bridget. (Spelling it Brynley might remove some of the visual similarity, and also give you the Brynn you liked.)

Brendan, Bridget, and Braelyn
Brendan, Bridget, and Bria
Brendan, Bridget, and Briar
Brendan, Bridget, and Briarley
Brendan, Bridget, and Brielle
Brendan, Bridget, and Briley
Brendan, Bridget, and Brinley
Brendan, Bridget, and Briony
Brendan, Bridget, and Britton (Britten? Brittyn?)
Brendan, Bridget, and Bronwyn
Brendan, Bridget, and Brooklyn

If I weren't going to use B/Br, I might look for a name with a strong B/Br sound in the middle (Gabrielle, for example), or I might find some other tie-in: Margaret, for example, to echo the ending sound of Bridget, or a strong D sound to tie it to the D sound in each of the other names. Some of these might not work with the surname, depending how close it is to Garnet.

Brendan, Bridget, and Aubrey
Brendan, Bridget, and Cambria
Brendan, Bridget, and Danica
Brendan, Bridget, and Gabrielle
Brendan, Bridget, and Greta
Brendan, Bridget, and Gretchen
Brendan, Bridget, and Gwendolyn (too rhymey with Brendan?)
Brendan, Bridget, and Juliette
Brendan, Bridget, and Keelin
Brendan, Bridget, and Kendall
Brendan, Bridget, and Madigan
Brendan, Bridget, and Margaret
Brendan, Bridget, and Meredith
Brendan, Bridget, and Sabrina
Brendan, Bridget, and Violet

Since you like both Ellen and Nora, Eleanor would be a nice way to get the sounds of both while diluting the negative family association. I'm also reminded of Lauren.

Ellen and Bevin and Brynn and Maeve make me think of Evelyn.

Fiona makes me think of Bianca, and also of Ione, and also of Catriona (I'm thinking of the four-syllable cat-tree-OH-nah pronunciation, rather than the Celtic three-syllable cat-TREE-nah pronunciation).

Oh, or Rowan! It's similar to Fiona, Ellen, and Bevin.

Name Updates!

2011-11-21T17:02:00.000-06:00

Update on Baby Girl N___stat, Sister to Lincoln!
Update on Baby Naming Issue: Roman Bishop!

Baby Girl Northcutt, Sister to Reid and Jace

2011-11-21T08:35:00.004-06:00

Meredith writes:

I enlisted your help a couple years ago in coming up with a name for our second boy. We are now pregnant again, and with a GIRL!!! But, we are once again having a hard time agreeing on a name. The middle name will be named after my husband's grandmother, Jo. The name we like is Collyn Jo, but I'm thinking that after having 2 boys, I want a pretty, girly, feminine name and Collyn has a "boyish" ring to it. Our boys names are Reid Michael and Jace Ryan. Another name I like is Charlotte. Our last name is Northcutt, so something that flows well with that. Even though the boys both have one syllable names, I think our girl will need to have a 2 or 3 syllable name in order to go with Jo. Thoughts?

Thanks so much! I love how you put so much thought into the names!!!!

If you want to tweak Collyn to make it a little more feminine (though changing the i to a y already does a good job of making it clear to the eye if not to the ear), I suggest Calyn (rhymes with Alan), nickname Callie if you want it (an improvement on Collie). Calyn Jo Northcutt; Reid, Jace, and Calyn.

Another option, even more feminine, is Calla. Calla Jo Northcutt; Reid, Jace, and Calla.

Jo would also make a wonderful first name. Jo ______ Northcutt; Reid, Jace, and Jo.

Was Jo short for Josephine? That would be lovely, too: Josephine Northcutt is a wonderful name.

Collyn reminds me of Marin. Marin Jo Northcutt; Reid, Jace, and Marin.

Just sitting here mulling the brother names, I suddenly thought of Piper. Piper Jo Northcutt. Reid, Jace, and Piper.

I think Kiley would work wonderfully, too. Kiley Jo Northcutt; Reid, Jace, and Kiley.

I agree that the middle name Jo works best with a longer-than-1-syllable first name. If you would otherwise have liked the coordination of three 1-syllable names, a similar idea would be to give all three children 4-letter names. Some possibilities:

Ayla
Eden
Ella
Iris
Isla
Kaya
Kira
Lila
Lily
Maya
Mila
Ruby

Or you could choose a longer name to go with the middle name, but one that has a 1-syllable nickname. Laney Jo Northcutt---but Reid, Jace, and Lane. Rosalie Jo Northcutt---but Reid, Jace, and Rose. Caitlyn Jo Northcutt---but Reid, Jace, and Cait. Teagan Jo Northcutt---but Reid, Jace, and Teag. Skylar Jo Northcutt---but Reid, Jace, and Sky.

Or if Jo was short for another name, you could use that other name as the middle name instead, and then be free to choose a 1-syllable first name.

Name update! Meredith writes:

I really enjoyed all the thoughts, opinions, and suggestions I received from you and your blog readers on the naming of our baby girl! We've decided to go with Brynn Kathryn. Reid, Jace and Brynn. :)

Thanks again!!!

Baby Girl James, Sister to Max Oliver

2011-11-19T08:27:00.008-06:00

Elena writes:

My name is Elena and my husband Oliver and I are expecting our second baby - a girl - who is due on the 5th of January. We have a son named Max Oliver, and we absolutely adore his name. Fortunately we do not have the problem of being unable to agree on any names. We have three girls names that we would be happy to use in a heartbeat, but they have some issues that may make them unsuable. Middle name will be either Elena or May after me (family tradition).

Our top name is Alaia, uh-LIE-uh. There is the obvious problem of "a liar". Infact when I told my mum that we loved Alaia her response was "Alaia? Like a liar? That could cause some problems." Although the next day she told me that she actually really liked it, after she thought more about it. It sounds sooooo pretty when you don't think of "a liar". But I would hate to give my daughter a name that gives her grief. Another problem is that Elena and Alaia are kinda similar sounding, though I do go by Elle 80% of the time. So what do you think? Is Alaia usable? If we used Alaia she would be Alaia May.

Our second name is Ruby. Max and Ruby. Like the childrens TV show. Does that make Ruby unusable for us? We LOVE it, and we love how Max and Ruby sound together, but does it seem tacky? Like we were trying to copy the TV show? She would be Ruby Elena. Max Oliver and Ruby Elena. Oh it's so cute! We are hoping to have one more baby, so if we had Max, Ruby and Theo (our favourite boy name) does that make it better?

Our third name is Mia. It comes with little problems, such as the repeating 'M' initial. Max and Mia. I think it sounds cute, but I don't know if it's too cutesy and tacky. We also know a few little girls named Mia, so I don't know if it's a bit popular (I know Ruby is popular too (at least in Aus), but we don't know any). Also the middle name is an issue, Mia May sounds way too cutesy, but Mia Elena doesn't sound right either because of them both ending in 'a'. So yeah, I'm just not sure.

Our last name is James, so we really want a girls name that is clearly feminine. Some other names we have considered, but aren't using are:
Scarlett
Amaia
Raina
Amelia

And like I said before, our favourite boy name is Theo, so if we have another boy this will most likely be his name!

So what do you think Swistle and readers? Are these names usable or unusable? Maybe a poll could be helpful. Suggestions for other names would be great too!

Another issue with Alaia is pronunciation: I wouldn't have known how it was pronounced, and probably would have tried "ah-LAY-yah" first (I'd be thinking, "Maybe it's like Alaina, but without the N"). After finding out the actual pronunciation, I noticed I immediately started using "a liar" as a mnemonic to help me remember how to pronounce it---unfortunately reinforcing that connection.

Names similar to Alaia that might avoid the issues:

Eliza
Isla
Lila
Linnea
Maya/Mya (same middle name problems as Mia)

My favorite is Eliza: to me it sounds almost exactly like Alaia, but without the liar-sound and spelling/pronunciation issues. Eliza May James; Max and Eliza.

My kids watched Max and Ruby, so for me it's an instant and deal-breaking connection. I think if you had another child in between a Max and a Ruby it would improve things somewhat---but still not enough for me to take it out of the category of "Names that were unfortunately eliminated by other names used."

Names similar to Ruby that might avoid the issues:

Abby
Alice
Daisy
Darby
Embry
Ivy
Libby
Lucy
Pearl
Phoebe
Prudence
Sadie
Shelby
Silvie
Zoe

My favorite is Ivy: the sassiness of Ruby without a children's television theme song springing to mind. Ivy Elena James; Max and Ivy.

I also like Phoebe. It has the sassiness and also the -bee ending of Ruby. Phoebe Elena James; Max and Phoebe.

Max and Mia are definitely very, very cute, but not in a way that makes me think Mia should be ruled out (i.e., just cute, not tacky). One concern is whether having two 3-letter, M-initial names will make you feel backed into a corner when choosing a name for a possible third child.

Names similar to Mia that might avoid the issues:

Calla
Cleo (but would rule out Theo for a future child)
Gia (maybe not with James)
Isla
Lia
Willa

My favorite is Willa. It's sweet like Mia, without crossing the possible Too Cute line, or backing you into a corner later. Willa May James; Max and Willa.

I also like Isla, especially since it appears on two of the lists: it's like a cross between Alaia and Mia. Isla May James; Max and Isla.

Name update! Elena writes:

Our little girl arrived a whole week early on the 29th of December. Oliver and I could not decide which name was our favourite, but we managed to narrow it down to Isla May and Lucy Elena. We had decided to wait until she was born to decide. When we met her, neither of us knew what name she 'felt' like. When Max came to meet her we asked him if we should name her Isla or Lucy, and he said Isla. So she became Isla May. We are all in LOVE with our Isla, and couldn't be happier with her name. I also love that Max got to choose her name...he tells everyone that he "choosed Isla"!

Thank you Swistle and to all who commented!

Baby Girl Wice, Sister to Natalie and Noelle

2011-11-18T09:51:00.003-06:00

M. writes:

I am hoping that you can help me with our baby girl name conundrum. My husband and I have two little girls and are due to expect our third (and final) child in January. Since all reports seem to show that this child is a girl, we are looking at the girl name list for a third time! Our other daughters are Natalie Sage and Noelle Juniper. While Natalie and Noelle both are Christmas names, we named them those names because we liked the sound of the names and not because they had to do with Christmas. We are not looking for another N name, nor are we particularly interested in continuing the Christmas trend, although it would have been Nicholas if the child was a boy. We also are fond of nature middle names since we love hiking and the great outdoors. Our last name is very similar to Wice (rhymes with mice). Our short list for first names includes Alaina (Lainey), Victoria (Tori), Amelia, Avery, and Rachel. Our short list for middle names includes Wren and Acacia. I am a little concerned about some of these names becoming too popular. I don't mind a trendy name but don't want my daughter being one of three with the same name in kindergarten! We are not necessarily locked into our short lists and are open to new ideas. What name do you think we should choose for our last little girl?

Popularity is such a tricky thing. Going by statistics alone (which is dicey, since the statistics are national and might not be played out in as small a sample as a classroom), Amelia is #41 and rising. Alaina is #207, but combining it with spellings Alayna, Elena, Elayna, Alena, and Elaina (most of which are rising, but not rapidly) brings it to #36---and adding in Lainey and Laney (which I wouldn't normally recommend because it's misleading, but just to give the idea for classroom-duplication-likelihood purposes) would bring it to #23. Victoria is #32 and gradually falling in popularity. Avery is #23 for girls and rising rapidly, but it's also used for boys, which increases even further the likelihood of another Avery in a classroom. Rachel is least common at #100 and falling briskly---though my mother taught in Christian schools and it's much more popular there, so it depends on your own circle. For comparison, Natalie is #14 and Noelle is #366.

With Natalie and Noelle, my favorite is Alaina (visually I think I like it even better as Elena, but that does make the nickname harder to spell; Elaina, maybe? but then the initials are EW, so never mind this whole parenthetical). But neither middle name seems quite right with it (I like it with Wren, but then Wren Wice seems choppy and difficult to say---although middle/last flow is not typically a big deal).

I think Ivy and Holly would both be sweet nature-theme middle names: not TOO Christmassy, more like "botanical names that just happen to be cool with the Christmas theme in case that appeals to anyone to keep that going." Alaina Ivy Wice, or Alaina Holly Wice.

I also think the name Laurel works beautifully: Alaina Laurel Wice. Or Hazel: Alaina Hazel Wice. For something more whimsical, I have a soft spot for the name Clover: Alaina Clover Wice. For the sweet birdness of Wren without the choppiness with the surname, I like Starling: Alaina Starling Wice. (And the "star" part makes it just a little Christmassy. I know you said you're not looking for that, but I'm finding it such an appealing theme!)

I thought I might look for a few more first name candidates, and I started by looking up Natalie in The Baby Name Wizard to see what categories she put it in---and she has Noelle for a suggested sister name! Since she seems to have your number, I wonder if you'd like any of the other suggested sister names: Gabrielle, Brooke, Jacqueline, Bethany. Or for Noelle: Simone, Lea, Eden, and Giselle. I like Bethany and Simone best. Bethany Acacia Wice; Natalie, Noelle, and Bethany. Simone Acacia Wice; Natalie, Noelle, and Simone.

I love Clara with the sister names and with your surname, and the very subtle Christmas tie-in (I can't stop!) is that that's the name of the little girl in The Nutcracker. Clara Starling Wice; Natalie, Noelle, and Clara.

Or Eva (slight Christmas Eve tie-in, if you want it). Eva Wice; Natalie, Noelle, and Eva.

If you decided to go with a third N name after all, I think both Naomi and Nora are wonderful. Naomi Wice; Natalie, Noelle, and Naomi. Nora Wice; Natalie, Noelle, and Nora.

Baby Boy Faith, Brother to Cade and Colin

2011-11-17T08:16:00.003-06:00

Candice writes:

Help please!
I am due in about 10 weeks with our third boy. We have Cade Bryan, who is 5, and Colin David Franklin, who is 3. Colin's middle names are his 2 grandpa's names, so we are set on honoring family. I am Candice and my husband is Bryan, and our last name is Faith. So obviously 'Christian' is not an option. We are having a hard time naming this last child! We are mainly looking at B or C names, but not exclusively. We like names that are somewhat unusual. Being a teacher, my goal is to not have my children be in class with someone of their same name. (although Cade has gotten quite popular since we picked it.) Here is the list we are considering, but by no means are we only going to use one of these. We are open to any and all suggestions! The top 7 are marked, the others are in no particular order. If this baby were a girl, she would have been Brinley or Lucy.

--Bryson
--Chase
--Owen
--Carson
--Max
--Cayson
--Cameron
Colter
Calum
Cyler
Camden
Casey
Coleman
Blake
Bryden
Brecken
Cole
Carlin
Kai
Brennan
Cruz
Andy

Any thoughts are greatly appreciated! thank you!

The name Cade had a peak in 2001 at #201, but since then has been steadily getting less common:

(screenshot from The Social Security Administration)

The name Colin is significantly more common than Cade, but has also been much steadier in its popularity ranking, which makes its popularity less noticeable. (Combining it with the spelling Collin, the name would be #70 in 2010.)

(screenshot from The Social Security Administration)

If your primary goal is to try to avoid classroom duplicates, I'd cross Owen off the list: it was #47 in 2010 and it's still climbing. Max is trickier to figure out: it was #98 in 2010, but combined with Maxwell and Maximus (two of the more common long-forms) it's already up to #46 so I'd cross that one off too. Brycen/Bryson together are #95; that's getting more comparable to the popularity of the name Colin. Chase is #66 (and sounds like a command when paired with the surname); Carson/Karson is #71. I'd scratch off Cameron: Cameron/Camron/Kameron/Kamron was #40 in 2010, but it's also used commonly for girls so that increases the chances of a classroom duplicate.

So from your list of favorites, I'd say Cayson is the best choice for avoiding classroom duplication. Even combining it with Cason, Kason, and Caysen, it was still only #253 in 2010: about as common as Cade/Kade, but still much less common than Colin and all the other candidates.

But the statistics are national so can be misleading: certain areas tend to have more of certain sorts of names. And statistics don't take into account how similar the names Cade and Cayson sound: I think there might be some trouble with people getting the sounds confused and ending up with Case and Cayden.

So I think if I were you I might go with a riskier-but-still-not-TOO-risky name from the finalists: Brycen or Carson, I think. Either of those is uncommon enough to be statistically unlikely to have two in a classroom, but quite different in sound from Cade and Colin. If you might have more children later on, I'd choose Brycen to introduce the second possible initial early on. If three is it, I'd lean more toward Carson.

Or, I might move down into the list of alternates. Is Cyler pronounced with a soft C like Cyrus and Cyril, or is it the same as Kyler? If it's a respelling of Kyler, I think I wouldn't use it because of mispronunciation hassles. Colin and Callum are hard for me to say together, and Cole seems like a blend of Cade and Colin, but I think Colter or Coleman would work great: they LOOK like they'd sound too similar to Colin, but they don't. Camden also seems like it would work very well.

Name update! Candice writes:

Thank you for your input and the advice of your readers! We have decided to go with Bryson Benjamin Faith. We have had some negative comments from family and friends that thought we should go with another 'C' name because we have Cade and Colin, but we think Bryson fits well with our family, especially considering my husband is Bryan. Thanks again for your help! Bryson should be joining us soon, and I'll be sure to send a picture when he gets here!

Name Updates!

2011-11-16T19:20:00.002-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Naming Issue: Does the News Corp Scandal Rule Out the Name Rupert James?
Update on Middle Name Challenge: Grace _____ Camden!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy Knick, Brother to Carter William!

Baby Naming Issue: A Grandmother Insisting on a Naming Tradition

2011-11-14T08:12:00.007-06:00

Kristen writes:

I am pregnant with my second baby due in April, and not only are we having trouble choosing the name of this little angel, but it seems that our 1 1/2 year old daughter's name is also again a subject of the name game... First of all, my name is Kristen and my husband's name is Angelo- I'm surprised our names are not up to debate. Our last name sounds like Scorus, my husband comes from Greece. Our daughter's name is Seraphina Madelyn Scorus - we just loved Seraphina and Madelyn was my Gramma's middle name. We call her Phina most times. I also have a 16 year old stepson traditionally named after my husband and his father- Angelo Jorge. Anyway... we do not know the sex of this baby although if he is a little boy we have settled on Atticus Maximilian. All the aforementioned drama occurs around a little girl's namesake.

We recently learned via a random, and very loud might I add, 2am phone call from Greece that my huband's very lovely, and very traditionally Greek, mother has used the 1 1/2 years following Seraphina's birth to stew on the fact that we did not name her Hericklia after her. Ok I went the unique, religious, traditional route with Seraphina and I am willing to push the name envelope, but I wouldn't even be sure what font to choose for the name Haricklia on baby announcements. And if you're wondering, yes we tried to satisfy this request with Lillian or Lili as a variation, even Harriet, but it's a no-go on the moniker route. I really don't think it's even our middle name style unless Swistle creates a miracle here. Which is entirely possible I've read.

So here I am, listening to advice ranging from "follow tradition" to "it's your baby, don't listen to anyone else." Whatever. Over it. My little girl can have two middle names and my mother (Ginger by the way, oh my goodness) at least understands my predicament and isn't insisting on including her name. Either that or the love of her future granddaughter has caused her to understand the possible effects of the name Haricklia Ginger or, Ginger Haricklia for that matter, stamped on her report card. So all I can think of is adding a third name, but my first daughter has only two. And this only semi-solves one problem- we still can't think of a female sibling name for Seraphina Madelyn, regardless! We've liked Scarlet (but Scarlet Scorus probably not), Charlotte (but we neither live in the city nor the web) and Genevieve (Umm it's okay we guess and Ginger appeared on it's nickname list- proof that I am not entirely an undutiful daughter). Oh, and the whole situation is compounded because due to medical complications, this baby blessing is most likely our last. Oh mighty Swistle, OH MIGHTY SWISTLE, help! Please? Or maybe I can just place an order for a little boy;)

Thank you very much!

If I'm following along correctly, the Greek tradition is to name the firstborn son after his father, and the firstborn daughter after the father's mother? So the tradition was followed for your husband's first child, but then was broken for his second. Is it possible that your mother-in-law isn't even asking to have her name used for the possible second daughter, but is just letting you know she's still mad about the first one?

It seems to me that if your mother-in-law is accepting no compromises on the name, it's unlikely she'd be satisfied by a compromise of the entire tradition (by using the name on a secondborn daughter instead of the first). Nor does it sound as if she'd settle for the second middle name slot. I think at this point it is up to your husband to say to his mother that the first daughter has already been named without following traditions, and that it wouldn't be right to give the firstborn daughter's naming tradition to the secondborn daughter.

However: I am aware that it is one thing to talk about how other people should handle things in our imaginations (where every such confrontation leaves the problematic person speechless in the face of our logic and eloquence), and another thing entirely to implement such plans with real people in real families---especially if the people and families love each other and want to get along and want not to hurt each other's feelings. It's easy for me to say that both your mother-in-law's name and her demands are unworkable; it's another thing entirely for you to have to deal with the fallout while I sit over here and don't have to take any phone calls about it. I do think firmness/resistance is justified here---but when dealing with someone who is already being unreasonable, I don't think it will necessarily help, or work, or bring her to the point of seeing reason and understanding the decision. (Except in my imagination, where she is not only embarrassed about her demands, but also very sorry for waking up a pregnant woman.)

So. That brings us to what WILL work. WILL your mother-in-law accept her name being used as a second middle name, or will she interpret that as a slap? If she will accept it, I think that's what you should do. It would bother me, too, that the sisters would have a different number of names, but it's an easy thing to explain to them with an affectionate roll of the eyes. Your younger daughter can drop the name entirely later on in life, or perhaps she'll like having her grandmother's name and enjoy surprising people with it and then telling the story.

It would also bother me to be giving in to an unreasonable demand (I'm imagining if my late mother-in-law had been making baby-name demands, and I'm not sure that would have ended well for anyone)---but again, sometimes it's the way these things go. A middle-name slot is probably worth it to avoid feuding and hard feelings. And I have some sympathy for her, if for example she winced while following these traditions with her own babies, and was thinking that the upside would be getting a dear granddaughter named after her. (DID she follow the traditions herself? If not, there's your out! If so, it makes it harder.)

If only first-name status will please her, you're stuck and you'll have to make your decision: let your mother-in-law name your babies as well as her own using traditions that are hers but not yours, or prepare wearily to handle the consequences. It's encouraging, though, that the consequence of not doing things her way with Seraphina's name led only to one single 2:00 a.m. phone call a year and a half later.

I know you said your mother-in-law rejects Lillian and Harriet, but I wonder if everyone could come to an agreement on Ariclia. (I'm pronouncing it ah-RICK-lee-ah or air-RICK-lee-ah or air-reh-CLEE-ah in my mind, but perhaps all of these are too different from the pronunciation of Haricklia.) This removes the unfortunate "hair" issue of your mother-in-law's name, while preserving much more of the essence of the name than Lillian/Harriet would. Ariclia seems exotic and usable to me (the names Erica and Leah make the sounds familiar), and a good sister name for Seraphina. I would suggest pitching it as "translating the name into English," instead of as "removing the unfortunate/unusable parts."

Another possibility is to see if she would be satisfied with ANYTHING ELSE. Would she accept a name with the same meaning as hers? Or her mother's name? Is there a traditional nickname for her name that would be usable? Or could you use your husband's grandmother's middle name, to parallel the choice for your first daughter, and explain that THAT'S the naming tradition you're using?

If the decision is made to use Haricklia as the second middle name, I like Felicity for the first name. I like Philomena even better, but I wonder if it's too rhymey with Seraphina. Or Victoria? Seraphina and Victoria. Phina and Tori.

Ooo, or Anastasia! Seraphina and Anastasia! I love that so much.

Kalliopi is a Greek name that looks like a creative spelling but isn't. I might use Calliope instead. Phina and Callie.

That makes me think of Penelope. Seraphina and Penelope. I love that too.

I know all these make for a very long name, but (1) my tastes run to long names for girls and (2) in this case, I'm inclined to think that when you're stuck with two middle names and one is long, AND your first daughter has a long name, you might as well GO FOR IT, length-wise. Anastasia Charlotte Haricklia Scorus. Penelope Charlotte Haricklia Scorus. Genevieve Charlotte Haricklia Scorus. WORK that alphabet. Or, of course, use a shorter middle name for the first of the two: Anastasia Jane Haricklia Scorus, Penelope Kate Haricklia Scorus, etc.

Name to Consider: Jevan

2011-11-12T05:59:00.001-06:00

Allison writes:

I was wondering if you could do a name to consider post for the name Jevan. jev-an. Basically just Evan with a J in front. I really like the sound of it but I was wondering if it sounds too made up?

Because I know a child named Javon (juh-VAHN), I saw the name and pronounced it similarly (accent on the second syllable: jeh-VAHN). I'm not sure how I would have pronounced it if I didn't know a Javon (whose name I heard before I saw). We ran into the same issue when we discussed Drewan: some of us saw it as DREW-win, and some of us saw it as dreh-WAN. I see the Social Security Administration has 33 baby Jevans born in 2010; I wish we could find out how they're pronouncing it.

I like it when an unusual name has an easy way to explain it to others hearing it the first time, and this one has really good ones: "It's like Evan, with a J in front." "It's like Devan but with a J."

It gives me the same reaction as when I first heard the names Jaron, Joren, and Javon: they don't sound made-up to me; instead they sound like names from another country or names I just hadn't encountered before.

What does everyone else think of it?

Baby Twin Girls Lavender, Sisters to Cohen Fox

2011-11-11T06:34:00.012-06:00

Erin writes:

I am currently 22 weeks pregnant with fraternal twin girls and I am due January 29, 2012. I really have a hard time coming up with girl names but think I have one for Baby A. My problem is that I am having a really hard time coming up with a first name for Baby 'B.' Our last name is 3 syllables, starts with L and rhymes with "Lavender."

My name is Erin, my husband is Daryl and our 18 month old son is Cohen Fox "Lavender." I love boy names and have no problem coming up with them. If one of these babies was a boy they would have likely been Emmett Hawk (Hawk, because I love animal middle names for boys). I like double consonants and also liked boy names Beckett and Wyatt.

I don't know if a description of my son might help with names, but he's a quick idea. My son is blond haired with beautiful, coarse waves and he is blue eyed (born with a full head of black hair though that changed when he was 4 months old). I'm assuming my girls might also follow this trend. My husband and I are both dark haired but he has blue eyes and I have brown. My son is stocky and sturdy. He's 35 lbs at 18 months old, but he's also off the charts for height. He has big blue eyes, a cute broad but button nose and full lips with apple cheeks.

I am a maternity nurse and hear names all the time and I think because of that I really don't like most of the top 1000 girl names on most charts.

As far as naming the twins, we have actually decided on Avalon Juno "Lavender" (Avalon actually came to me in a dream and I loved it) for Baby A and we know that we want Quinn as a middle name for Baby B.

I had originally picked Tabitha as a first name for Baby B but my whole family pretty much hates it (mainly because of the shortening to "Tabby"...I like the idea of Beth as a nn though), so I'm back to the drawing board. I recently took a liking to Everly and Ember but again I'm getting snubbed noses. I think Everly might be a bit to close to Avalon because of the soft vowel and then v sound (and you might get Avy and Evie for nicknames which are really close).

I prefer 2 to 3 syllable first names as well. I like names from fantasy/fairy inspired, or that are just off the beaten path but not too "out there." Names already used by a couple of my cousins that I love are Briar and Brynn. I like nature type names as well. I really like Willow, but again...no family approval. So frustrating! I got a lot of flack about Juno, but my husband loves it and it's a middle name so we are keeping it as is. I think it would be cute to have the name start with B (then we would have first initials of A, B, C, D, & E in our family), and thought Braeleigh was cute, but my husband didn't like it because it's a bit of a mouthful with our last name. I'm also not a fan of alliteration with our last name though so I've been avoiding "L" names.

Anything you could suggest at this point would be so helpful.

and

I thought I'd send an update on our naming process. We could still use a bit of help! I am almost 28 weeks pregnant now with fraternal twin girls. Baby A is still Avalon Juno "Lavender" at this point and we have decided on Baby B's first name to be Brooke. We definitely want to use the middle name Quinn but I'm having a hard time with the flow of Brooke Quinn with the hard K sounds so close together. I thought of switching the middle names, but my husband doesn't want the initials "BJ" in there. My sister has a friend with those initials as well and has had nothing but teasing for ages. The name Quinn is important for us to keep because it is a name my sister loves and she wants us to use it. Considering she was our egg donor for our IVF pregnancy, I really want to use it too. I'm sure we could compromise on the middle names and remove Juno (although we've liked that name since I was pregnant with my son), and have Avalon Quinn and Brooke ____ . So stumped!

Any help would be great!

Thanks

I wonder if any of the names your family doesn't like (or any of the names you liked except that they didn't work as sister names for Avalon) would work as middle names for Brooke.

Brooke Ember
Brooke Everly
Brooke Tabitha
Brooke Willow

My favorite from that group is Tabitha: Avalon Quinn and Brooke Tabitha. I like the way they'd each have a 1-syllable name and a 3-syllable name.

But looking at the logic puzzle presented in the letters, it seems like the easier part to change is the first name Brooke. That's the name that's currently preventing you from using Juno, which was unshakeable in the first letter and which you say in the second letter you've liked since you were pregnant with your son. It looks like it's a matter of choosing which name you'd prefer to use, Brooke or Juno---and Brooke is a more recent choice, and one that doesn't fit your first-name preferences as well as Avalon does.

The Baby Name Wizard mentions both Meredith and Bethany as names similar to Tabitha. I'd add Meribeth, a name we encountered on a child at the pool this summer and really liked. Avalon Juno and Meribeth Quinn.

Or Matilda. Avalon Juno and Matilda Quinn.

Or Minerva. Avalon Juno and Minerva Quinn. I like all the V sounds with your surname.

I wish Lorelei would work with your surname, because that would be so perfect with Avalon.

Ember reminds me of Cambria. Avalon Juno and Cambria Quinn.

Everly reminds me of Waverly. Avalon Juno and Waverly Quinn. V sounds again.

Willow and Briar remind me of Juniper. Avalon Juno and Juniper Quinn. I don't know if the repeating June-sound would bother me or not; I might even kind of like it.

For a B name, one that comes to mind is Bronwyn. My impulse is to switch the middle names, but that lands you right back with the BJ problem, so it's a little rhymey with Quinn. Avalon Juno and Bronwyn Quinn.

Another is Briony, which can be pronounced BRY-oh-nee as a botanical reference, or BREE-ah-nee as a modern sound-combination name. Avalon Juno and Briony Quinn.

Another is Beatrix, one of my own favorites. Avalon Juno and Beatrix Quinn.

Another is Bridget. Avalon Juno and Bridget Quinn. I like the repeating short-I sound in Bridget Quinn: it sounds happy and energetic to me.

If Brooke is set, I'd add Waverly to the middle name candidates. Avalon Quinn and Brooke Waverly.

Name update! Erin writes:

I just thought I'd drop a line to let you know that our baby girls have arrived! They made their debut 5 weeks premature at 35 weeks and 2 days. We wanted to thank you for your naming advice and for all the feedback it received. We decided to name Twin 'A' - Avalon Juno and Twin 'B' - Bellamy Quinn. I love their names!! The twins are fraternal and completely different. Avalon was the bigger and fairer of the two at 5 lbs 7 oz and Bellamy was 4 lbs 8.5 oz and has a head of dark hair. We are using the nicknames "Avy" and "Bella" for short. I do have a quick follow up question though...How would you spell "Avy" without giving it a hard A sound? Avy, Avi, Avie, Avee, Avey? No matter how I look at it, it seems to sound like Navy without the 'N.' For a 22 month old, Cohen is a great big brother too! Now we have our A,B,C,D,E family ;)

I have also attached a picture of the girls at 3 weeks old. Avalon is in the front, and Bellamy has her hand on her sister's shoulder.

Thanks again!!

I would use Abbie/Abby as the model and spell it Avvie or Avvy.

Name Updates Galore!

2011-11-08T06:48:00.003-06:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl Rose, Sister to Simon!
Update on Baby Boy or Girl Wibbly!
Update on Baby Girl Herrason!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy Jelens!
Update on Baby Naming Issue: A Name That Works in Britain, the United States, and Australia!

Five-Year-Old Girl Voisey, Sibling to Ezekiel, Basil, September, and Soren

2011-11-07T08:44:00.005-06:00

Karla writes:

You've helped me before: http://swistlebabynames.blogspot.com/2008/06/baby-girl-or-boy-voisey.html.
We ended up having a boy, and we named him soren micah.

NOW, we are adopting a girl, and based on your help (and suggestions) from last time, I would choose Iris Mabel in a heart-beat. And am still very open to that...
BUT, our daughter is going to be close to 5 1/2 when we adopt her, and her name right now is Yan Rui (pronounced Yonna Roo-ay, with Rui prounouced as one syllable).
While we believe giving her a name that we have chosen is an important means of communicating her place in our family (I know there are different thoughts about this, but that's where we stand right now), we wonder if it is best to keep it as similar to her name now as possible.....OR if not that, to at least choose a name that is similar in meaning.
If we go by meaning, her name means "happy" and "lucky". Names that we have found that mean similar things are Felicity, Felice, Aida...I don't mind any of these, except Felicity Voisy sounds weird. And Aida is too close to Adeline, our deceased daughter, and we're not comfortable (nor do we feel its appropriate) to make our newest daughter any type of namesake (also based on Swistle fan commments from last time).
If we go with names that sound similar, we have only come up with Anna (pronounced Onna) Rae. What do you think?

Thanks again

I see what you mean. I feel the same way about names: that giving a name, because it's one of the official acts of parenthood, can be an important symbolic relationship-establishing act---but that when the child in question is five, it's more important to let her keep her own name. I'm imagining my six-year-old daughter and how she'd feel about changing her name to something else (even if it was something that meant the same as her name), and it's giving me a wrenched feeling.

I wonder if it would work to use Yonna or Yana? It would be translating her name from one language to another, which is a common thing to do with names (especially if the name was originally in another alphabet), and as I say it and think about it, I think it's a very pretty name. It'd distinctive and a little exotic, but easy to pronounce, and familiar because of names like Donna and Brionna. For unusual names, I love if there's an easy thing to say to help someone understand the name, and Yonna has a perfect one: "It's like Donna, but with a Y instead of a D." Or "It's like Brionna, but without the Bri." I also think it goes well with the other sibling names, and especially with the sister name: Ezekiel, Basil, September, Soren, and Yonna is a nice mix. And I like it with your surname: Yonna Voisey.

Yes, I think that would be my first choice. I think I would translate her name to U.S. English and spell it Yonna or Yana; I'd leave her middle name spelled Rui because pronunciation issues are no big deal and even kind of fun when it's a middle name; and then I would give her a second middle name of your choice, anything you like (though a name like Felice would very pleasing symbolically), and I'd make a big deal about how that is the name you are giving her now that she is your child and a part of your family.

What does everyone else think the Voiseys should do?

Baby Boy or Girl B_____ss, Sibling to Owen Albert

2011-11-06T08:14:00.003-06:00

Amy writes:

I am due with my second child on TUESDAY and I need HELP with a name. To make matters worse, the baby was not cooperative during the ultrasound and we have no medical reason to have another so we need to pick names for boys and girls. I love talking baby names and reading naming books & blogs, but my husband doesn't like to talk about them at all which is not helping.

My first son is Owen Albert and our last name starts with B and ends with ss. My husband and I are Bryan and Amy - VERY popular names for our generation - I was one of 3 Amy's in my first grade class and my husband was one of 4 Bryan Bs in his grade. We picked Owen just because we both liked it - its a little bit more popular than I'd hoped but so far we haven't met any others his age in our small town. Albert is after my grandfather, who died just before Owen was born.

My main concern for our boys names are honor names and sibling rivalry. For a boy, one name that was on our short list for our first son but just didn't seem to suit him was James Everett, after our 2 fathers. My issue now is that I'm not sure how I feel about naming my first son after a great-grandfather he never met (and only in the middle name) and then giving the second son a name after 2 grandfathers that he sees all the time - we all live in the same small town so we see my father and my husbands father very regularly, 2 or more times a week each. Does this seem like a reason for sibling rivalry to you? The other issue is that this "uses up" the only family names we like for boys, AND it means I've "used up" all the names from my side of the family leaving none for my sister (the only male options left on that side are Matthew which is always used for the oldest son of the oldest son and has been used already this generation and Elmer and Dudley - not appealing to either of us). On the other hand, I'm not sure how I feel about using one grandfather's name without the other - is it insulting to use one and not the other when they both know James Everett was on the table at one point? And all the other boys names that were on the shortlist for Owen are either too similar to Owen (Evan, Ethan, Gavin) or have been recently used by close family or friends (Caleb, Colin). Other names I've suggested that my husband vetoed: Miles, Elliot, Neil, Liam. We have 2 requirements for our names - not a biblical name, boys names without a -y nickname (Robert to Robby, John to Johnny) because in my family the little boy nicknames stick for life and I'm not fond of them (and yes, I know, James violates both rules - my father is called Jim and is still called Jimmy by his brothers, but I'm willing to break the rules for a family name).

For a girl, my shortlist names are Claire, Maggie (short for Margaret or Marjorie) and Paige, but we don't have a middle name yet. Claire is a family name, the others are just ones I like. My mother, grandmother & I all have "R" middle names, so that would be a fun tradition to continue but its not a 100% must.

So the overall question is: do you think its a problem to "use up" family names on the second child when you think you want 3-4 and leave none for my sister? And what about the sibling dynamics with a second boy named after such close relatives? Should I go with my gut and say that if I have to ask it, then its probably a problem? And if this is too much of a problem, what in the world should I name this kid?

Feel free to edit this down to a more managable post, the overall question above is what I most care about.

Thank you!

Name update! Amy writes:

Thanks to all your help Swistle & commenters! Although I still really liked James Everett, it just didn't seem right for this baby either, and although I liked the suggestion of Everett James I didn't like the idea of always saying "which Everett? Grandpa Everett or Baby Everett?". In the last few days before he was born, one name came forward as a top contender, which had been our "joke" name for our first son - Porter. It was an inside joke to us, since we brew our own beer. But with the rise of occupation names and -r ending names like Connor and Asher, Porter grew on us more & more. I also found out that Everett was a family name - it was also middle name for my husband's grandfather and at least one generation back as well. So on 11-11-11 after much deliberation we welcomed Porter Everett and are very happy with his name. Thanks again!

Baby Boy Secret, Brother to Tate and Cole

2011-11-05T08:29:00.000-05:00

Melissa writes:

I am kicking myself!

I am due in one week with our third boy. We have known for months and months that we were having a boy, and we worked very hard at getting pregnant. We had a tough pregnancy that we thought we'd lost several times, and then about midway through, we learned he was quite small and had to watch him closely with near weekly scans and measurements and an amnio we weren't planning on having just to prepare us for anything that might come.

Well, the results were relieving, and he's finally doing great and growing, and I've been really relaxed and happy for the first time in this pregnancy - for the last month of it!

I think I am in denial, however, as we still don't know how we are going to NAME HIM!

With our other two, we were clear, certain and excited by our selections. Our first son is named Tate Fletcher. Our second son is Nicholson Scott, but we call him Cole. So we have Tate and Cole. Our last name sounds like Secret.

At first, I thought I really loved the name Leo for our new little guy, given how small and what a fighter he is. He'll be our lion cub. But I wasn't sure my husband was all in as he was a bit 'Meh' about it. So I came up with a few other names, floated them and then we sort of left it.
We just knew we'd know when the time came. Well, we don't, and the time is nearly here... Aaaaargh!

Our short list (I think) is:

Jude
Leo
Luke
Corbin
Rafferty (with nn Rafe)

And our middle names are:

Henry (after Mark's Grandfather)
Lloyd (my dad, who is loved by all)
Christopher (my brother I adore and who is the best uncle ever - no kids)
William (a family name)

I am not against Luke per se, but feel it is awfully popular. Mark likes it but could go with Jude. I like Jude, but worry it may be trending toward the girls (grrrrrr...another great boy name that the girls snatch!) I also think it sounds like we're sort of trying too hard with the 3 short, strong, one-syllable names. I love, love, love Rafferty, but my best friend does NOT like it. It makes me nervous. If I had to pick right at this second, I'd probably go with Leo Christopher, but I'm worried I'm settling with the easiest and that I'll regret it.

I'm really struggling here, and Mark has no clue either. I've been reading your blog for months, LOVING it, and never thought I'd come close to needing you!

Help?

Name Updates!

2011-11-05T06:15:00.005-05:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Twin Girls Forrester, Sisters to Sam!
Update on Baby Girl or Boy Voisey!
Update on Baby Boy Wall-Ridges, Brother to Harriet Lucille and Matilda Corinne!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy Lyman!

Baby Girl B_________ton, Sister to Henry and Casper

2011-11-04T08:34:00.010-05:00

Emily writes:

Help? We are due to have our third child in four weeks, our one and only daughter as we have two boys already. One would think I'd have a girl's name left over from the first two rounds, but I feel like I may have outgrown our original girl's name (Olive). My sons are called Henry and Casper, and I'm looking for something short and sweet but am struggling to find one name that speaks to me. Beyond short and sweet, we'd like to use my husband's late mother's name, Eliza, probably as a middle name but possibly as a first name to then use the middle name as what we call her (ex. Eliza Lake B____ton). I wouldn't mind including my grandmother's name, Lily, as well, but I'd like to maintain creative license on the name we actually call her. Is four names overkill?! And aside from that, just to make the job even harder the parameters get smaller as I'd like the name not to end in a "y" sound, like Henry, an "er" sound, like Casper, and I'd prefer it didn't rhyme with our last name, which starts with a B and ends with "ton". What on earth is left?!

Names I've been mulling over so far....to be used as a first or a middle name with Eliza (and possibly but not necessarily Lily Eliza)

Tate
Read (a family name)
Lake
Plum
Eve
Olive
Lou
Elery
Indigo (Indigo Lily Eliza B_____ton, call her Indi, such a mouthful?)

Please guide me, Your Excellency! I'm so thrilled to finally have my baby girl, I just wish I knew what to call her!

Many thanks

I think four names works fine. My own kids have four names each, and it's been less of a hassle than I'd expected: even with five kids, I've only had to make two total corrections on forms. And it seems like a good solution here, where you have a lot of names you'd like to use. But I think ideally it works best to keep Name Irregularities at one per customer. So if you do give her four names, I suggest having the first name be the one you call her. Or if you do call her by her middle name, I suggest keeping her names down to three instead of "I go by the first of my two middle names." (Again, this is just ideally: sometimes other considerations are more important, and worth it.)

I wouldn't use Lily as the first name with the middle part of your surname [the surname is hidden for the post, but I can see it in the email]: it runs together rhymily for me with all the repeating sounds. I think it can work as a middle name, but I think it works better if separated from the surname by Eliza.

I'm also not sure if it will work well to use both Eliza and Lily, especially with the similar sounds of your surname, and especially if you also decide to use Olive: that's four names in a row with LI. Might you have another child later to use Lily, or is it now or never? I seem to be repeating myself a lot in this post, but despite the little hesitations I keep mentioning, I want to re-re-emphasize that (1) some names are more important than the minor issue of repeating sounds and (2) it matters less when we're talking about middle names. So ____ Lily Eliza B_____ton would be just fine, if this is the last child and it's important to you to use Lily. Though I think then I'd go with a simple first name (especially with a long surname): more Eve than Indigo. Eve Lily Eliza B_____ton is one of my favorites of the possibilities.

I also suggest Rose. It's common as a middle name, but unusual and fresh as a first name. It's short and it's sweet; it's great with Henry and Casper and doesn't repeat the endings; it's simple and non-rhymey with the surname. Rose Eliza B______ton; Henry, Casper, and Rose. Downside: probably rules out the idea of also using Lily.

Another flower name that I think works well for you but again probably rules out Lily: Iris. Iris Eliza B______ton; Henry, Casper, and Iris.

Another of my favorite short-and-sweets is Cora. Cora Lily Eliza B____ton; Henry, Casper, and Cora.

And another is Jane. Familiar but still uncommon; similar in sound to Tate and Lake; short and sweet; no repeating endings or rhymes. Jane Lily Eliza B_____ton.

Or for something even more unusual: Lane, which brings it closer to Lake from your list. Lane Eliza B_____ton or Eliza Lane B______ton.

Or Grey. Eliza Grey B______ton; Henry, Casper, and Grey.

I wonder if you'd like Cleo? Cleo Eliza B____ton; Henry, Casper, and Cleo.

Or Sloane. Sloane Lily Eliza B______ton; Henry, Casper, and Sloane.

One of my mom's favorite short/sweet/unusual names is Esme (EHZ-may). Esme Lily Eliza B____ton; Henry, Casper, and Esme. I like the way the sounds of Esme and Eliza go together, alternating with the way the sounds of Lily and B_____ton go together.

More ideas for Henry and Casper's little sister?

Baby Naming Issue: Spellings of Riley

2011-11-03T07:53:00.005-05:00

Allyson writes:

I gave DH a list of lovely girl names (in no particular order: Madeline, Lauren, Alexis, Kaylee, Amelia, Emmaline, Hallie, Haley, Sydney, Riley, Addison, and Ashlyn) and there were two names he didn't veto- Riley and Addison. I prefer Riley over Addison, so that's the name we are currently debating. The problem is I think it should be spelled Riley, since it's the most common spelling. Having to grow up as Allyson, aka "that's Allyson with two Ls and a Y," I greatly value using the common spellings. He thinks Riley is a boy's name and it should be Ryleigh. I hate it, I think it looks too contrived. I suggested Rylee as a compromise, but he thinks "lee" makes it a boy's name. Sigh. So I guess my question is two parts: 1) Are there any other obvious spellings for Riley other than Ryleigh, Rylee, Reilly (which would be my second choice), and Rylie (which is listed as an option on Baby Name Wizard, but it makes me want to say Ri-Lie? 2) What do you do when you agree on a name but not the spelling?

Thanks!

Well, if you're Paul and me, you abandon the name, feeling bitterly resentful about the other person's ridiculous stubbornness. We both liked the name Elliot, but I ONLY liked Elliot and he ONLY liked Eliot, so we didn't use it at all and I'm still a little crabby about it.

This question reminds me of the Ivy vs. Ivee question we did awhile back. Our basic consensus was that the spelling is an important part of the name: if the spelling has not been agreed on, the name has not been agreed on---and often this ends in needing to move on to another name choice.

As with the Ivy/Ivee question, I'd start by using facts to see if I could break down resistance. Riley is not "a boy's name": according to the Social Security Administration, in 2010 it was given to 5,506 girls and 3,606 boys.

Nor does "-lee" make it a boy name: in 2010, the spelling Rylee was given to 2,957 girls and 314 boys. Now, if he would like to say that it FEELS like a boy name to him when it's spelled either of those two ways, he may do so (though it seems like he would be eager to attempt to adjust his feelings to reflect reality), but he may not argue that it IS a boy name.

The only spellings of Riley I don't see on your list are Ryley and Ryli. (I also saw Rylei, Rilei, and Ryliegh in the Social Security data, but I'm chalking those up to misspellings or different pronunciations.) I'm not going to recommend Ryli but maybe Ryley has potential: changing a vowel to a Y is a common feminizing device, so perhaps this would be a good compromise spelling. And considering how many spellings there are of Riley, I think she's going to have to spell it each time no matter what.

The other option is to use Riley as a jumping-off place for finding a new name:

Addilee
Bailey
Briley
Callie
Ellie
Karli
Keely
Kiley
Miley
Rilyn

Baby Girl or Boy Rhymes-With-Bones, Sibling to Silas

2011-11-02T09:04:00.010-05:00

Taylor writes:

Hi! I'm a longtime reader of your blogs and am expecting my second baby, gender to surprise us, in early April. Our last name is very common and rhymes with Bones. We have a three year-old boy named Silas D@vid, a name which I was unsure about at first but which I LOVE LOVE LOVE now. Both of Silas's names are family names, although Silas itself is from so many generations back (i.e., the Revolutionary War) that it didn't hold any sentimental meaning. My husband and I are both in our thirties. My name is Taylor and my husband's name is Matt. Given that Matthew was the most common boy's first name the year we were born and our very common last name, my husband was/is adamant that our children have somewhat unusual names. I am similarly adamant that these names be actual people names and not random words or places. (He lobbied hard for Silas to be named after various Civil War battlefields--Appomattox "Bones" was his favorite. Clearly I vetoed.) I also have a preference for family names.

I have two questions for you:

1) We are pretty settled on a girl name. If the baby is a girl, we want to name her after my mother. Unfortunately, my mom's name is somewhat problematic: Mary Gay--and she goes by Gay. Mary seems too vanilla, especially with our super common last name, and Gay is out because of obvious schoolyard taunting reasons. BUT, we both love the name May. Is it weird to name a child after someone without using that person's actual name? What does everyone think about this phenomenon?

2) We are completely stumped when it comes to boy names, which is problematic given that at our most recent ultrasound, we saw what appear to be boy parts. The tech, by our request, did not say one way or the other, so maybe it was a poorly placed umbilical cord?

I like the name Jasper (my great-grandfather's name), but my husband hates it. He likes the name Moses (an old family name), but I don't know.... It might grow on me though. I like the name Asa (also an old family name)--he's on the fence. Other potential family names: Henry (too common?), Lucius (problematic because of Harry Potter villain?), Sullivan, Boon, Homer (obvious Simpsons issue). Non-family names my husband likes include: Micah, Josiah, Ezekiel, Elijah, Ezra, Isaiah. Of those, I like Ezra best. We both like Abraham, nickname Bram, but friends of ours just used it.

Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks

Normally I am on the conservative end of the spectrum with namesakes: I think the very first change to a name causes a huge drop in honor. However, in this case I think you have a strong point against using Gay, and another strong point against using Mary.

Mary is a name like John: it's considered an almost generic name for a girl, and yet encountering one in an actual classroom is a pleasantly startling surprise. And so I'd currently be trying to pressure you into reconsidering it---except that your mom doesn't go by that name. My objection to changing a name is that it causes a drop in honor---but in this case using Mary might be the same drop.

Do you know how your mom feels about it? Does she identify with the name Mary but prefer Gay, or does she dislike the name Mary, or does she forget it's her first name and not recognize it if someone calls her by it accidentally? And is there a story about why she goes by her middle name? If it's because she dislikes the name Mary, I think that safely rules it out; but if it's because it was the name of her dearly-loved grandmother, who then moved in with the family so they started calling your mom Gay to avoid confusion, then that's another story. And does she realize the difficulties with passing down the name Gay, or does she think that's silly? All these things weigh in.

Going just on the information we have (you'd like to name a girl after your mother, but neither her first nor her middle name are good candidates), it looks to me as if your solution of using the name May might be the best possible option. (One slight hesitation I have is that May Rhymes-With-Bones brings to mind May June, but I can't tell how universal that reaction would be.) Would your mother's maiden name (or some other name of significance to her, such as her mother's name or her mother's maiden name) work as a middle name? That would help increase the honor back up towards using-the-actual-name levels.

Another possibility is to name her Mary May Bones and call her May. This uses your mother's real first name, and also parallels the first-middle combo AND the way your mom goes by her middle name.

Or May is a nickname for Mary, so you could name her Mary with a different middle name and call her May directly. Molly is another cute nickname for Mary, so you could see which nickname she grew into.

From the boy names neither of you is ruling out, I like Ezra and Isaiah best. The Harry Pottery reference of Lucius doesn't bother me, but I don't like the way Silas and Lucius sound together: so much L and S. (I have a similar but lesser issue with Moses.) Lucien would take out one of the S sounds and remove the Harry Potter issue---but it also removes the family-nameness. I think I would reserve Boon for the middle name slot: it's hard to find good one-syllable middle name candidates that aren't overused. Or I also like some of the other family names for the middle name: Ezra Sullivan Bones, Ezra Lucius Bones, Isaiah Sullivan Bones, Isaiah Lucius Bones, Isaiah Henry Bones.

My brother and sister-in-law had Silas on their list and also liked the name Calvin. Calvin Boon, Calvin Henry; Silas and Calvin.

Cal makes me think of Mal which makes me think of Malcolm. Malcolm Bones; Silas and Malcolm.

Would Abram be too close to your friends' choice of Abraham/Bram?

I also like the early-American-settler sound of Abel "Bones."

I think Gideon is underused, and goes wonderfully with your surname and with Silas.

Another name I consider underused is Rufus, but I'm worried it might be too rhymey with Silas.

I think I've seen Conrad on the same finalist lists with Silas before.

Oh, I wonder if Haskell would work? Silas and Haskell.

Or Hugo might be very handsome, and I like the repeating long-O sound. Silas and Hugo.

Or Milo or Leo, for the same reason. Silas and Milo; Silas and Leo.

Which makes me think of Lyle: Silas and Lyle. Too much long-I and L, maybe?

Or would you like Everett? Everett Bones; Silas and Everett.

Baby Naming Issue: Roman Bishop

2011-10-30T05:30:00.008-05:00

Ms. Bishop writes:

I’m having a naming dilemma and have approximately 6 weeks left before our baby boy arrives!!! I hope you and your readers can help.

Coming up with a name that both my husband and I liked was difficult enough. We finally came up with a list of about 5 names we both liked, ordered them favorite to least favorite independently, and were both happy to see we had the same name listed as our “most favorite”. The name is Roman. We LOVE the name Roman. So – what’s the dilemma you ask? It’s our last name. Which is Bishop.

Roman Bishop

Our family is fairly traditional, so I wasn’t surprised or bothered when the grandparents (on both sides) scrunched their noses up to the name Roman. They did the same thing with our naming choice of our daughter (sounds like Caden, but with a different spelling), but they’ve learned to love her name just as much as they love her. But – they have pointed out the very thing that is bothering me too – the combo issue. Are we giving our son a name he’ll have to “overcome”??? I don’t want people seeing/hearing his name when he’s older and think that we named him that to be “cute” or “silly”. I’m having such a hard time with this!! He already feels like a Roman to me, so I hate to give the name up. Even our second name choice doesn’t seem to fit as well anymore (our #2 name is Vince).

Ugh – why does this have to be so hard?!

I’m going against the advice of my husband in asking for opinions. He thinks I should stop worrying about what other people think. And, he keeps reminding me that our son will always have the option of going by his middle name (Michael) if he decides he doesn’t want to go by his first. That’s another thing – I personally don’t like the name Michael – but I’m okay with having that as his middle name as a compromise to my husband. So – it would kinda break my heart if our son decided to have that be his primary name. I wish he could talk and tell us his thoughts already on his name! J

Am I overthinking this way too much??

Thanks so much for the help!!

As with all such issues, opinions are going to be all over the spectrum. But my opinion is that Roman Bishop is not a workable name. As soon as I saw it, my eyes widened and then sparkled, and there was an audible laugh. Let's have a poll over to the right to collect the rest of the spectrum. [Poll closed; see results below.]

"Not worrying about what other people think" is a concept more appropriate for moral situations, where we know we're doing the right thing and so we shouldn't worry if other people make fun of us for it; it doesn't apply as well to a name we're asking someone else to carry. I recommend The Baby Name Wizard's test: Would we want to have this name as our own? We all have names we're unable to use because of our surnames, and I'm afraid this is one of yours. (Others include Deacon, Noble, Skip, Fisher, Phillip.)

I suggest Rowen/Rohen or Ronan. They're similar to the name you love, and they may still cause a few people to crack jokes, but it's no longer as blatant. Other possibilities:

Coleman (may be too close to Caden)
Damon (may be too rhymey with Caden)
Eamon (may be too rhymey with Caden)
Redford
Redmond
Reid
Rhys
Roan
Ruben
Ryan
Simon
Tillman
Truman

Name update! Ms. Bishop writes:

Again, thanks so much for posting my dilemma.

I’m writing you back to let you know that my husband and I decided to stick with Roman. It was just his name already. That, and my husband was DONE with the naming discussion....

And again – thank you. Although we’re going against the grain here, I still really appreciate you posting this and the feedback received.

Name Updates!

2011-10-28T08:44:00.002-05:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl G1bs0n, Sister to C00per and C@mden"!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Naming Issues: Would You Notice a Pattern of Vowel Names? Is Amelia too close to Emmelia?

Baby Girl Hanson, Sister to Blakely Michelle

2011-10-27T06:28:00.010-05:00

Kari writes:

We are trying to come up with a name for our 2nd daughter who is due on Thanksgiving! Our 1st daughter is Blakely Michelle and our last name rhymes with Hanson. Blakely was a family name from my husband's side of the family that we both loved. I realize it is a unisex name and surname but now I am drawn to names such as Emma, Chloe, Daphne, Calista, Amelia, Aubrey, Evelyn, Lila and Clara. Which I don't know if they flow nicely with Blakely or sound too different. Calista is at the top of our list right now but worry about the Flockhart association and if it goes with Blakely. We do tend to prefer names that are not too popular (like top 10- even though 2 of our favorites are there). Also, I don't want another name that has the -ley or -son sound at the end. Also, Blakely is Old English I have been drawn to more English sounding names too. For the middle name we like Jane (after my mom's middle name) or Kate (we just like it) or Renee (after my sister's middle name). Another factor is that this baby has been really active and feisty so some of the softer, refined names don't seem to "fit" her.

Names that we like but can't use are: Avery, Lillian, Regan, Sadie, Elliot, Olivia, Ivy, Alexis, Addison, Madison.

Names that we talked about but have been ruled out either due to myself or my husband are: Piper, Tatum, Penelope, Phoebe, Kendall, Riley, Bailey, or Taylor.

We originally were told we were having a boy and had so many names options such as Parker, Garrett, Graham, Ethan, Brennan, Andrew, Noah that we LOVED.

I hope you can help us! I am desperate to have a name and get baby things monogrammed and ready for her!

and

Writing again...I think we have narrowed down our name search to two names, Amelia (nn Mia or Millie) and Chloe with Amelia being our #1. However, I am still concerned about it "going" with Blakely and don't want the sibling names to sound mis-matched? Thoughts?!?!?

Please help!

One thing that makes things easier in this situation is that although Blakely has a unisex sound, it's not particularly unisex in usage: it's used for approximately ten times as many girls as boys, and similarly girl-heavy names such as Blakelyn and Berkeley make it seem even more on the girl side. If sibling-name coordination is important to you, this leaves you more free to choose from girlish names.

I think if I were you I would aim to match not so much the style (since your style has changed) as the uncommonness. Blakely and Chloe, for example, gives one girl a very unusual name (not even in the Top 1000) and the other girl a very common name (Top 10). Amelia is #41 and making a jump upward each year; I suspect it will soon also be Top 10, or very near it. Calista would be my top choice from your list: Blakely and Calista is a great popularity match: in 2010, 278 new baby girls were named Blakely/Blakely/Blakelee/Blakeleigh, and 412 were named Calista/Callista/Kalista/Kallista. The names are both uncommon but familiar, and I think the Calista Flockheart association, while still present, is significantly weakened. Plus, the name Calista sounds feisty to me.

However, if you do choose Chloe or Amelia, I think it's common for a firstborn's name to be a name of significance that doesn't necessarily coordinate in style with the names of subsequent children. I think the main issue is to make sure that the names don't seem to communicate different expectations, as if the parents have decided in advance the personality type they'd like each daughter to have ("One tomboy and one little lady, please!" or "One judge and one cheerleader!"). Of the two, I think Blakely and Chloe share more of the same spirit.

If Amelia is your frontrunner but you hesitate because it doesn't meet some of the preferences you were hoping to meet, one possibility is to use Amelia as a starting point for looking for names that are similar but also feistier and less common. Cordelia. Aurelia. Delia. Amaya. Melina. Emery.

Let's have a poll over to the right for Chloe and Amelia and "back to the drawing board." [Poll closed; see results below.]

Baby Boy or Girl Hainsworth, Sibling to Mackenzie, Dylan, and Keira

2011-10-26T09:02:00.005-05:00

Taylor writes:

My husband and I are due to have our fourth child on November 10th and with only 25 days to go, we are entering panic mode. This baby, gender unknown, will have 3 siblings; Mackenzie Harper (7), Dylan Elliot (4) and Keira Rose (2). Baby naming has always caused me and my husband to clash, but this time it seems to be even worse with our differing name styles, most likely due to the fact that this will be our last child and the gender is unknown.

Names on my List:
BOYS:
Nolan- my top name at the moment, but this changes daily
Connor- not that big on the hard -C sound following Keira

GIRLS:
Delaney- my top (and only) girls name, husband cannot seem to get used to it

Husband's List:
BOYS:
Jacob- too popular, but he really wants a little "Jake" around the house
Gavin
Ethan
Levi

GIRLS:
Riley- would it be okay to pair this with Dylan, also a unisex name?
Molly
Addison

Middle name will most definitely either be Grace or Elisabeth

Please Help us!

ps. (my name is Taylor "Tay" Hainsworth and my husband is Brendan)

I think Delaney may be too close to Dylan: so many shared letters and sounds, and in fact I think of them as a Kylie/Kyle pairing. Laney or Lainey might work, and maybe your husband would prefer it because it's more like Riley and Molly. It still shares letters with Dylan (the Laney spelling in particular makes my eyes want to unscramble one name to form the other), but it takes away the shared "dill" sound and that's a big help. And it's great with the sister names: Mackenzie, Keira, and Lainey.

If Jacob is too popular but your husband wants to use Jake, Jacoby (juh-KOH-bee) might be perfect. It gives you the nickname Coby, too, as another option.

The repeating endings of Dylan and Nolan might make it clearer that both are boys---or it might seem too matched, I can't tell. Gavin seems almost perfect: the endings are similar but not exact.

Braden would work, too. Braden Hainsworth; Mackenzie, Dylan, Keira, and Braden.

Or a name like Eamon (AY-mon) would emphasize the Celtic roots of the sibling names. Eamon Hainsworth; Mackenzie, Dylan, Keira, and Eamon.

Ian, too, would be very handsome, and reminds me of Ethan and Levi. Ian Hainsworth.

Opinions will vary wildly, but mine is that in this sibling group I would assume a Riley was a boy. I wouldn't assume it completely, so it isn't as if it would be a huge shock to find a female Riley, but it's so perfect as a brother name for Dylan. In fact, would you consider moving it to your boy name list? Girls Mackenzie and Keira, boys Dylan and Riley.

Riley and Molly make me think of Miley. Miley is all girl, and fits well in style with the sibling names.

Or Piper. It's drifting more from the sound of Riley, but it shares the style. Piper Hainsworth is adorable.

Or I wonder if you'd like Ellery? I think that's wonderful with your surname: Ellery Hainsworth.

And that plus Addison from your husband's list makes me think of Emerson. Emerson Hainsworth; Mackenzie, Dylan, Keira, and Emerson.

Has the Baby Name Dexter Been Ruined By the Show?

2011-10-24T06:24:00.003-05:00

Jenny writes:

Could you maybe sometime do a poll about the name Dexter? Is it completely ruined by that show? It would be pretty awful for your kid's name to make people think of a serial killer. I'm curious as to how main stream is that show. Has everyone heard of it? Do you think even in 10 years, it will still matter?

It's SUCH a great name. Love the X and the classic feel and the nickname Dex.

Oh, good question! The name Dexter has come up a few times on name lists here, and it seems like most times it's accompanied by "but---the show" reasons why it can't be used. Let's see how prevalent that opinion actually is, with a poll over to the right. [Poll closed; see results below.] I think we can get an idea of how much it's seeped into the culture by finding out how many people who HAVEN'T seen the show have nevertheless heard of the character Dexter.

Whether it'll still have that association in a decade is a trickier thing to determine with the poll, but it'll be fun for the comments section. If someone mentions the names Lorelei/Lorelai or Rory, a lot of us think of Gilmore Girls; but if someone mentions the names Luke or Emily or Logan, it doesn't necessarily come to mind. It's the difference between unusual names and ones that are so common their associations have been thoroughly diluted. It's also the difference between names that come to our attention because of a show, versus names that were already familiar and in regular use. Dexter may fail in this category: it wasn't common before the show, so few of us have ever known any Dexter except the one on the show, which makes the association strong.

Poll results (529 votes total):

Have watched show; name ruined by it - 69 votes (13%)
Have watched show; name NOT ruined by it - 131 votes (25%)
Have NOT watched show; name ruined by it - 120 votes (23%)
Have NOT watched show; name NOT ruined by it - 209 votes (40%)

Baby Girl Cahnoodson, Sister to Liam Asher

2011-10-22T07:30:00.004-05:00

Laura writes:

I have been a regular reader of your blog since I became pregnant with my second child, a girl. I am now 38 weeks along, and a wrench of indeterminate size has been thrown into our baby-naming process.

Background: At least five years ago, my husband and I fell in love with the name Sophie, were we ever to have a daughter. It is the only girl's name we have ever agreed on. It would have been our 3 yo son Liam's name if he'd been a girl, without question or hesitation. We like the meaning of the name, and far prefer it to the more popular Sophia, and we think it works nicely as a sib-set with Liam, whose middle name is Asher (our last name sounds like cah-NOOD-son). With this pregnancy I have been considering alternatives, because for some reason I've become bored with Sophie. It feels faded to me, like a shade of paint that I don't love, but now it's too late and too much work to repaint the room (or something like that.) I considered and liked Alma, Ada, Adelaide, Stella, and Eliza - a derivative of my own middle name, Elizabeth, and also the name of many of my ancestors. My husband only likes Alma from this list (for awhile we had decided on the first/middle Sophie Alma - but that eventually seemed just too old-lady for me and, I thought, not a good match for the more modern-sounding Liam Asher). My husband likes Sierra and Gabriella, neither of which I really like. Just last week it seems, we finally settled once again on Sophie for a first name and my own last name for her middle name (rhymes with Pam). "Settled" being a good word for it....

Wrench: last weekend, my mom - in her mid-60s - announced that she is getting remarried (she and my dad divorced about 1 year ago after a long, long separation). The man she is marrying, whom we have all known for a long time, has a grown-up niece he is extremely close to - named Sophie. He thinks of her like his daughter. While it is unlikely we will interact with his Sophie very much, since she lives across the country, I feel like somehow naming my daughter Sophie is a tribute to him, which is NOT the message I want to send to her or to my dad or to anyone in our family. And even though we have been secretive about our baby name choice, out of the blue my mom suggested Sophie to me a few months ago - which makes me even further not want to use it. Since absolutely nobody saw a marriage proposal coming, including, I think, my mom - I didn't have to consider this before. Now I feel like just when I had come around to choosing Sophie again, there is a strong reason not to use it. Even my husband said today, "Do you still like the name Eliza for a first name? I guess I could get used to that...". We have less than 3 weeks before our baby is born. Help! What suggestions do you have for naming our little girl?

Thank you SO much

It's hard to give up a name you've been committed to for so long and start the selection process all over again---but if you were feeling bored with the name, this engagement might be exactly the merciful kick needed to let you start fresh. I definitely don't think you NEED to start over: I think we could find ways for you to make it clear that this was not a tribute ("Yes, what a funny coincidence! We've had this name picked out for years---since way before Liam!")---but if the problems with the name Sophie have piled up too high now, we are ready to roll up our sleeves and find something new.

I think Eliza is so wonderful, I almost want to leave my sleeves where they are. It's perfect with Liam. It's perfect with the middle name. I love the family-name connection. It's one of my own favorite names: I love how flexible it is, working well for sassy girls or shy girls or smartypants girls or sunshiney girls or goth girls.

Another place to look is other names with the same meaning as Sophie (I'm using the "Intelligence & Wisdom" section of Baby Names Made Easy: The Complete Reverse-Dictionary of Baby Names). Minerva is one of my favorites, and I see Alma on the list. I'm not sure if Liam and Alma share too many letters/sounds---or if that's the very thing that makes them work together.

Or we can see if we can find something between your list and your husband's list. You like Stella and he likes Gabriella, so Ella might be a possibility. Liam and Ella.

Or I wonder if you'd like Annabel: it has the -el sound and some of the frilliness of Gabriella, but with Anna to fit it more with Ada and Eliza. Liam and Annabel. I love that almost as much as Eliza.

Or Fiona. Liam and Fiona. Both have a Celtic style and that same I-sound, and the "fee" sound in Fiona is reminiscent of the "fee" sound in Sophie.

Or Isla, or Iris. These remind me a little of Alma, but more current.

I know a sibling set named Liam and Nora and I think it sounds really good together. Very similar styles without seeming over-matched.

Starting with Sierra, but trying to bring it closer to your style: Sabrina. Liam and Sabrina.

Or Clara. Liam and Clara.

Or Cecily. Liam and Cecily.

Starting with Gabriella, but trying to bring it closer to your style: Genevieve. Liam and Genevieve. Evie for short: Liam and Evie.

Or I love Eva anyway, but especially with Liam: Liam and Eva.

Baby Girl or Boy Zimmerman

2011-10-21T08:10:00.004-05:00

Sara writes:

My husband doesn’t hate my chosen girl name (Norah Anne Zimmermann) but he doesn’t love it. Since I was sixteen or maybe younger (and I’m almost 30 now) this has been what I have wanted to name my little girl, and so this him not liking it is really making me sad. (I chose Norah Anne because Norah is my daddy’s first name abbreviated spelt backwards (his name is Ron) Anne is my mother’s middle name but also his mother’s middle name. Our boy name (we aren’t finding out what we are having) is Jackson James Zimmermann which we both love.) I feel like Norah is already a person to me, MY little girl, and like I’m abandoning her. I mean my heart is really breaking over this. I know that if I got upset/cried over it/pushed a bit I could make him go for it, but then I’d always wonder, our whole lives, if he let me name her Norah because I was being a big baby about it and he secretly hates her name.
His comments about it are wide…one day he’ll say it doesn’t sound like a strong name. The next he’ll say he thinks it sounds too much like, too close too, Noah who is our nephew, which I think it’s a stretch to say they sound the same, I know it’s just one extra letter but I don’t find that similarity to mean we can’t use it. He comes home from work with suggestions so my feeling is he’s really hoping he’ll find a name he likes that I can also like, and that Norah just isn’t doing it for him.
His suggestions:
His number one and what he keeps bringing up is : Brigen (my problem is it’s a place, a holler in our home town to boot(no longer live there), not a name, and I can’t get over how it sounds slangish for Bringing, you know so any middle name you give her sounds like she’s bringing it, you know, Brigen Grace, Brigen Hope …so forth)
Molly (it sounds like a little girls name, but not like a woman’s name)
Sadie (I don’t like the sad in it, and again sounds like a little girls name)
Jessica (Eh,)
Ruby (no)
Ruth (which his big selling point is we could call her Baby Ruth which, I’m sure she’d appreciate that.)
I’ve been trying hard the last week to ditch the name Norah and find something else I like, but everything seems to please me way less than Norah but here’s what I have:
Elery (I like how soft this sounds, but he'd probably buy Norah over this)
Sophia (I like this, but not Sophie, which she’d end up being called I’m sure)
Hannah (I like this but I had a dog named this once, which not sure my child would appreciate that story)
Emma (but it seems, overdone)
Isabella (maybe the same as emma overdone?)
Cora (I like this best but fear I like it best because its so similar to Norah, and if he was to soften to Norah should we have another girl, we couldn’t have a Norah and a Cora)

I feel like we’re in a situation where someone is going to have to fold. I mean, Norah has been such a part of my dreams for years, like I said earlier it’s almost like I’ve dreamed her into existence, and so I feel like I’m grieving this loss. I’ve told him somewhat how much I love the name and that I’ve always thought of it as my daughter’s name, but I haven’t pushed it and I don’t want too. But If he doesn’t start liking it soon, then I’m going to have to give it up, and I don’t want to be looking at my newborn baby and wishing she had a different name. Maybe this baby will be a boy and I’m doing all this worrying for nothing…but.
How would you deal with this issue? Do you have any suggestions of names that I might like as well as Norah? Our baby is due early January.
Thanks

I think the first step is to consciously separate the name from the child. When you say abandoning the name feels like abandoning the child, you're explaining to us how intensely you feel about the name and the style of intensity it is---but I think it could help to see if you can reason with your feelings. Picture the baby growing inside you, and picture a little slideshow of names going over his or her head, one second each: Liz. Roger. Hailey. Caden. Margaret. Elmer. Bitsy. Ian. Jennifer. Brady. Madison. Liam. April. Elliot. Bianca. Nick. Notice how the curled comfy growing baby stays the same and only the name changes.

We know this is how it is: the baby is who he or she is, and won't be swapped out for a different baby if you don't use the name you'd planned to use at age 16. We know that if you are carrying a girl and you abandon the name Norah, the name blows away like a dry leaf but your daughter stays right where she is: you lose the name, but not the child. Some names may feel more like "my baby" than other names, and that's a good sorting method for finding one's own naming style---but the baby is your baby either way. And in this case, it sounds like Norah is the name of your little girl where "your" was singular: the dream-baby of a young girl who wasn't picturing another parent being involved. Now that the other parent has arrived and the baby is more than a dream, it seems appropriate to find a name for your-plural little girl.

It will be difficult to do this if you compare each new possible name candidate to the name Norah. If the name Norah is out of the running for this baby (and it sounds like it is, if your husband doesn't love it and you don't want to use it unless he does), your goal is not to find a name you like better than the name Norah, but instead to find the name you like best of the names that remain. (And I think you're smart to keep in mind that Norah might be a possible sister name later on: Paul was opposed to a name with our first baby, but then he's the one who chose it for our second baby.)

You came up with Norah by spelling your dad's name backwards, so you could look for other names that include "nor," such as Eleanor or Honor or Honora.

Or you could look for names that spell his name forward, such as Bronwyn, Veronica, Rona, Caron, Claron, Heron, Aeron, Cameron. (I prefer this idea, since classically the concept of spelling something backwards has been used to indicate creepy opposition.)

Or, as you say, perhaps this baby will be a boy.

From the candidate list, Brigen reminds me of Bronwyn from the "contains Ron" list, so perhaps Bronwyn would be a good compromise name.

Brigen also reminds me of Megan and Reagan and Bridget and Rowan and Brinley and Brooklyn and Keegan and Teagan and Morgan.

I think Molly does work on grown-ups, but it can also be a nickname for Mary. Or you could use Holly.

If you like Elery and Emma, I wonder if you'd like Emery or Emily or Ella or Hillary.

I also think Lila(h) would be a very good candidate.

Name to Consider: Briar

2011-10-19T10:00:00.005-05:00

Meg writes:

So, I'm very early in my pregnancy, however we're already discussing names. The name that my child's father is totally stuck on is Briar. I hated it at first (I'm a Jane, Anne, Henry, Nicholas, etc kinda person), but the more I toss it around I'm kinda coming to like it some. I'd love to get your, and your reader's, opinions. Is this a cute new name that's kind of "out there" or would we get the same reaction everyone had when Gwyneth Paltrow named her daughter Apple?

The two issues I've found so far are the connection to a briar bush, and when said over the phone people can hear "dryer" instead.

Thanks so much!

I can think of two more issues (plus I'd add that it can also sound like "prior" or "Pryor"). One is than when written, it can look like "Brian." And the second is that if your style tends to be more Jane/Henry, choosing a name outside your usual preferred style for a first child might make you feel locked into finding names outside your preferred style for subsequent children as well. Many people like a name or two in a style category they don't generally like, but then would be really stuck if they wanted to choose more names from that same category.

I don't think of it as an Apple-type name, however. I think of it as Unusual Botanical, along with Juniper and Magnolia---not Highly Unusual Botanical with Apple and Spruce. Let's have a poll over to the right to see what everyone thinks of it. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results (483 votes total) for "What do you think of the name Briar?":

I love it! I'd use it! - 48 votes (10%)
I like it! I'd consider it! - 107 votes (22%)
I like it for someone else's baby - 174 votes (36%)
No particular opinion - 33 votes (7%)
Slight dislike - 83 votes (17%)
Strong dislike - 38 votes (8%)

Baby Girl Heintz, Sister to Parker Griffin

2011-10-17T10:05:00.000-05:00

Erica writes:

We are pregnant with our 2nd baby on February 13, 2012 - a GIRL, and we are so excited! We live in Portland, Oregon, and we have a 22 month old boy, Parker Griffin Heintz, and this will complete our little family. Now, when I tell you that coming up with Parker's name was difficult, that will be an understatement. It took MONTHS. I had lots and lots of names that I loved. Logan, Henry, Oliver, Harrison, Jackson, Quentin, the list goes on.

The problem is that my husband (Jordan Gabriel) is a 5th grade teacher. And as a teacher, he has had hundreds of students pass through his classroom, and now associates certain names with certain traits (both positive and negative) that take that name off of the list. He is also extremely sensitive to tease-able names and nicknames. I was given two family names (Erica Joycelyn) after my dad (Eric John), and we're determined to stay away from family names due to having two sets of divorced/remarried parents and just too many toes to step on there.

We also both agree that we like names that have a positive meaning, and even more so if they are related to nature and/or an actual concrete "thing" that we can put on stationary, stuff like that. So, you see, when I hit on Parker (protector of parks) Griffin (awesome mythical creature), it was perfect. Match that with the fact that miraculously, he had not yet had a Parker in his class... and we have the coolest boy name ever. Whew.

Now we are trying to name our little girl. And so far, things are a little bumpy. We have two names that are close, but something about both of them just isn't quite right for me (husband really likes both of them, but is open to new suggestions). I have exhausted "Beyond Jennifer, Jason, Madison and Montana", the Baby Name Finder on babycenter, and just about every other source. We want something a little unusual (also, this helps when trying to avoid the "classroom conundrum" as I call it). The two names we're looking at:

Claire Finley Heintz
Hadley Grace Heintz

Things I LIKE about them: Finley means sunbeam, and I really love that. I also really like the sound of the "ley" at the end of a name. Hadley starts with an "H" which is something I love love love with our last name (one of my favorite potential names for a boy was Henry Heintz. How CUTE is that??). Grace is just beautiful and I think it is a nice traditional balance with the less common Hadley. I also like that it starts with a "G" like Gabriel (husband's middle name) and Griffin (Parker's middle name). Claire is such a pretty name, and I've always really liked it.

Things that are holding me back on choosing either of them: Claire seems so serious to me. I don't know why, it just does. Maybe its the single syllable. I think I'm wanting something a little more sing-songy and I don't know how else to put it, but friendly. Hadley I really like, but its almost not feminine enough. But its close. So close. And maybe in the end that is what we'll go with, but there is just something niggling at me that its just not HER name.

So, maybe it will help to know what the other names on our list have been:
Caroline (husband thinks its too formal)
Ellie (husband thinks its too silly)
Lily (name of the daughter of one of his coworkers)
Daphne (no specific objections, he just doesn't love it)
Piper (this one is his, and I just can't get on board with it. I think of bagpipers)
Hillary (we both really like this, but feel like its a little too political)
Hailey (this one is close to being a contender)
Elena (husband thinks it sounds too Eastern European, and since we're not, he thinks it sounds phony)
Maya (see issue with Elena. Same kind of thing)

I just want to find that name that just "clicks" the way that Parker Griffin did. I just have this feeling that we're so close, but there is something we're not thinking of. I know you get tons and tons of emails, and I will just cross my fingers that maybe you have some great ideas for us!

Thank you so much!

Baby Naming Issue: Okay to Use Part of a Child's Babyhood Nickname as a Subsequent Child's Name?

2011-10-16T06:23:00.005-05:00

B. writes:

My husband and I are going round and round discussing whether or not it is appropriate to use the name we like for our future son. Our first son had multiple nicknames and was called "Buster Malone" for about the first two years of his life. Malone is not even CLOSE to his real name in style or rhythm and only shares one letter with his real name. Over time that nickname has drifted away and hasn't been used at all in several years. My husband and I often reminisce about the old nicknames our kids picked up (we've had three more kids since then) and we both really want to use Malone for our son to be. But we don't know if it is appropriate to use one child's nickname as another child's name.

Our first son is much older now and does not even remember the nickname. I am not too worried about him being upset if we use it but I worry that if we do name our son Malone he will resent having his name be a hand-me-down from his oldest brother. The likelihood of keeping the origins a secret are next to impossible. All of our kids know where their names came from and the stories behind them are often shared and remembered. What do you think? Is it inappropriate? Am I setting my son up for disappointment because I gave him a "used" name? Or does it not matter at all and I am worrying about it for nothing?

My opinion is that Malone is available for use as a name, and that in fact it improves the nickname stories. I'm imagining telling the stories to my own kids, and their faces when I say that Firstborn's nickname was Malone. To me it doesn't seem so much a handmedown as an inspiration: that is, that the nickname made you think of the name as an actual name candidate.

Namesake names are not exactly the same situation but have some parallels: it doesn't diminish the name that someone else had it first, and in fact that is the very thing that improves the name and makes it a candidate to consider. And I don't know if the dynamics will be the same in your family, but in our household the youngest boy greatly looks up to the oldest boy and would likely be as thrilled to have a name connection as he is when we say "You know who used to wear this shirt? ROB!!"

Let's have a poll over to the right to see what we think as a group. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Baby Girl or Boy Con___ly, Sibling to Madison Mae, Logan Clara, and Conor Martin

2011-10-15T06:17:00.006-05:00

Lisa writes:

We are due to have our 4th child in two weeks and have yet to come up with a girl name that we can agree on/fall in love with. My husband is of Irish heritage and he really loves Irish type names for girls: Erin, Shannon, Caitlin, Bridget, etc… As the youngest of seven children, his older siblings have already used these Irish type names for their kids. The one name he loves is Maggie, short for Margaret. I’m not in love with it-I hear a ringing of “Maggie Moo” in my head whenever I try to talk myself into liking it. Also, I don’t think an old fashioned name such as Margaret jives with our other children’s names. We have two daughters and a son: Madison Mae(Maddie), Logan Clara, and Conor Martin. All the middle names are family names. I love surnames as first names and unisex names for girls.

I’ve considered:

Finley Holly (Holly is my mom’s name)

Adelaide Elsie (using Adel or Layla for short-hubby is not in love with Adel)

Tobin Holly (Tobin is his grandmother’s maiden name & traveled here from Ireland)

If we have a son, our list includes:

Declan Sean or Patrick

Beckett Sean

Brodie Patrick

Our last name is Irish starting with a Con and ending in an –ly (sounding like lee). I’m desperate for your input and suggestions. I don’t share our list with anyone because I hate the negative associations people love to share, “in fourth grade a girl by that name used to tease me and I’ve hated it ever since”….blah-blah-blah! Thanks so much for your time!!

The name that makes this such an intriguing puzzle is Logan. Madison is an all-girl name in the top ten. Conor is an all-boy name, #30 for boys when spellings are combined. But the name Logan is mostly boy: about 96% of Logans born in 2010 were boys, making it #17 for boys---a rank comparable with Madison's and Conor's when used for a boy.

It isn't that someone would be shocked to find out that a Logan could be a girl (it's #484 for girls), but they would be statistically more likely to assume boy, and this assumption would be supported by a sibling group where the other children have gender-unambiguous names. As a boy's name, Logan fits perfectly with Madison and Conor in both style and popularity; as a girl's name, Logan breaks the style and popularity pattern---and breaks it in a dramatic way. For a comparison in a different style, it would be like a family having an Amanda, a Leslie, and a Jeremy---where Leslie is a boy.

So this presents us with an interesting dilemma: Do we work with the name style you've set, which will further isolate Logan's name by piling up more false evidence that the name is a boy's name? Or do we add a second startling choice, which will have the counter-intuitive effect of making the sibling group MORE cohesive? A sibling group of Josephine, Kadence, Edward, and Vivian causes Kadence to stand out like a sore thumb; but a sibling group of Josephine, Kadence, Edward, and Riley merely tells us that the family likes a variety of naming styles.

This is more complicated in your case, however, because of the name Logan SEEMING to fit beautifully, until we find out it's the opposite sex we have been led to expect by the beautiful fit. It's like trying to find a fourth for Amanda, Leslie, and Jeremy. The first three names SEEM to coordinate beautifully, so adding a Kadence at the end wouldn't create that mixed-group feeling: it would instead result in two surprises instead of one. I think this is what Margaret is like in your group: it creates a second stand-out choice, instead of helping to unify the group. (Also, Maggie is very close in sound to Maddie.)

From your girl name list, I think Finley works best. One downside of Tobin is that it is currently never given to girls in the United States; it might work better as a candidate for your tradition of family middle names. Adelaide has several downsides: it's all-girl like Madison, which further isolates Logan; it's antique-revival rather than modern/surnamey like Madison and Logan; and Addie is a common nickname for it, and you have a Maddie (even if you choose a different nickname, she or her friends may choose Addie later on). Finley seems perfect: it's given to boys and girls, and so it bridges the gap between Madison and Logan. I hesitate because of the doubled -ly ending with the surname, but because the name Conor doubles the first syllable, I assume it isn't an issue that bothers you.

Brodie and Beckett both seem like good choices from your boy name list: they're mostly boy, but given occasionally to girls. In fact, I'd recommend considering both for your girl name list. Madison, Logan, Conor, and Beckett sufficiently neutralizes my assumptions about who's a boy and who's a girl.

Another possible option is Braden/Brayden. It's mostly boy, like Logan and Conor, and it fits with the style of the other names. It would work in this sibling group for either a boy or a girl. (As a girl name, it has the effect of isolating Madison, but I'm less concerned with "the only girl name never mistaken for a boy's" than I am with "the only girl name continually mistaken for a boy's".) Or Hayden would work well. Or Payton/Peyton. Or Greyson/Gracen. Or Morgan, Brennan, Kieran, Rowan, Keegan, Keaton, Quinn, Riley. Any modern and/or surnamey name that works for boys and girls seems like a good option for either a boy or a girl.

Name Updates!

2011-10-14T09:56:00.003-05:00

Update (and photo!) on Baby Naming Issue: How Will the Royal Engagement Affect the Name Kate?
Update (and photo!) on Baby Girl Dougherty, Sister to Ella Catherine!
Update (and photo!) on Baby Boy Smith, Brother to Declan River!

Middle Name Challenge: Grace ____ Camden

2011-10-14T09:25:00.006-05:00

Holly writes:

My husband and I are expecting our second baby, a girl. She is due on the 31st of October, but as her older sister was two weeks early, I have a feeling she will be early too. Our first daughters name is Sophia Catherine. Catherine is my mums middle name, and I love that Sophia shares that with her. We sometimes call her Sophie-Kate, which I absolutely love!

We have decided that baby girl #2 will definitely be Grace, with Gracie as an occasional nickname. However we cannot decide on a middle name. We have searched high and low for a family name to use, but really don't like any. The only family name we would consider using is McKinley, but I'm not too sure about it. I worry that Grace will be jealous that Sophia got a feminine middle name that we love, and she got a more masculine middle name that we are only okay with.

We have ten middle names we like, but we like them all and can't decide which is our favourite!
In no particular order, they are:
Grace McKinley
Grace Adelaide
Grace Juliana
Grace Alaina
Grace Matilda
Grace Lillian
Grace Imogen
Grace Alexandra
Grace Amelia
Grace Louisa (I thought she could be Gracie-Lou, but is it tacky or cute to have Sophie-Kate and Gracie-Lou?)

I should also mention that our last name is Camden, and we are not too fussed on how well the middle name flows with it. For example Catherine Camden sounds a bit funny, but we love Catherine so it doesn't bother us. Also I have worried that if we don't use McKinley as Grace's middle name, she will be upset that we didn't use a family name. However I have decided that if she does complain I will just let her know that we didn't use a family name as we wanted to use a name we loved.

I was hoping that you, Swistle, would be able to create a poll with these names. I am also curious to see which middle name stands out to you.

Thanks :-)

You have a long list there, so what I'd suggest first is seeing if you can eliminate some least-favorites. Paul and I once narrowed down a too-long list by having each of us go through and rank each name. Any that were tied could have the same rank, like this:

Henry 1
Milo 1
Elliot 2
Leo 2
Charlie 3
Alan 4
Daniel 4

Held up next to each other, two lists like that can show you that, for example, both of you have the same several names in the #1 slot so you can start focusing on those, or that there are several names in the lowest slot that can probably be eliminated as not having any chance of trumping the higher-ranked names. (It can also show you if you're nearly opposite and need to consider a mid-ranked name as a compromise.)

In the meantime, I will go into the thicket with my machete on the Highly Opinionated setting, to see if I can quickly take it down to my own favorite.

Grace McKinley immediately stands out to me: I think it's gorgeous and striking. BUT: the important thing here is that YOU'RE not finding it gorgeous and striking. It sounds to me like you're hoping for a family name but that your main priority is finding something feminine that you love---and I vote for going with that. It's common for a firstborn to get a family name and for the siblings not to. (Or would you want to use your own name? Grace Holly Camden is so pretty.) And for all we know, the fight could end up being that Sophia is jealous because she got a grandma middle name and Grace got the cool middle name, or whatever.

Grace Louisa also stands out to me, and I'm in favor of the Sophie-Kate and Gracie-Lou idea.

If it were me, I would probably take out Grace Adelaide because of the way they run together in a "saddle" sound. The other vowel-beginning middle names give me that run-together problem, too. Normally I'd mention too that first and middle names are not often said together---but since you DO say your first daughter's first and middle together often, I think you might do so with your second as well.

And I'd take out Grace Juliana and Grace Lillian for some reason I can't put a finger on.

I said I was taking McKinley out, but I'm putting it back in. I really love family names, and Grace-McKin or Gracie-Lee might be super cute as nicknames. But again, this is just my OWN list, and yours might look quite different when you use your own machete.

So my narrowed-down list would look like this:

Grace McKinley Camden
Grace Matilda Camden
Grace Louisa Camden

I like all of those approximately equally in their full forms, but I'd vote for Grace Louisa for the sake of the Gracie-Lou nickname (and because even though it's my own list, I'm remembering your tepid feelings about McKinley). Sophia Catherine and Grace Louisa; Sophie-Kate and Gracie-Lou.

Let's have a poll over to the right to see everyone else's favorites (it'll only let you vote for one, but feel free to make expanded lists in the comments section). [Poll closed; see results below.]

Name update! Holly writes:

Our beautiful healthy girl arrived on the 25th of October. We decided to name her Grace McKinley. Big sister Sophia is in love with her, and calls her "Gacie-Kins" (Gracie-Kins) all of the time!

Thank you to Swistle and all of the readers who helped convince us to use McKinley.

Baby Naming Issues: Margaret Atwood and Maisie

2011-10-12T08:43:00.004-05:00

E. writes:

I am currently pregnant with a girl, due this winter. My husband and I have always loved the name Maisie, and I was pleased to learn it’s a nickname for Margaret, the name of a beloved family member. My problem? Our last name is Atwood, so she would share a name with the well-known author, Margaret Atwood. We do plan on calling her Maisie, so the obvious solution would be to just name her Maisie and be done with it. But I do like the idea of naming her after a family member, and I also worry that Maisie is too whimsical as a “real name”, and she wouldn’t have something more formal to fall back on when she becomes a Supreme Court justice (ahem). I have always gone by a nickname for my formal name, and liked having something more serious to use professionally, in publications, etc. So I guess I have two questions for you and your readers: First, how weird would it be to have a child named after someone famous (though, admittedly, it’s not like we’re naming her Angelina Jolie)? Secondly, do you think Maisie is too whimsical to be anything but a nickname? I keep going back and forth on this, and would really appreciate an outside opinion. Thank you!

This is a pair of questions I can see getting opinions from ALL OVER the spectrum. My own set of opinions is that I think the Margaret Atwood connection is too strong to use the name (not because of either a positive or a negative association, but based only on the STRENGTH of the association), and that I think Maisie works better as a nickname for a given name.

I had to think a bit to come up with those opinions, though, because it's so hard to tell when a name is worth using despite issues with it: I often come down on the side of "Yes, I see the issue---but if you really want the name, it won't be all THAT much hassle, and you should go for it." What I finally did was imagine it as my OWN name. Would I want to keep discussing the Margaret Atwood thing? No. And if my name were Maisie, would I also want a more professional option? Yes.

You could do some fancy footwork and make Margaret the middle name (the connection is still very strong for me there, though) and give her a different first name but nickname her Maisie. Or you could name her Mae or May and call her Maisie. (I like the sound of Mae Margaret, too, if you want to use the honor name.)

Let's find out where the rest of us are on the spectrum. Let's have TWO polls over to the right: one on the Margaret Atwood association, and one about Maisie as a given name. [Polls closed; see results below.]

Baby Boy Tanner, Brother to Zachary Stephen and Cameron Anthony

2011-10-10T08:00:00.014-05:00

M. writes:

My Husband and I are expecting our second baby boy in 3 months and are having a hard time with a name. He has a son, my stepson, named Zachary Stephen and we have one named Cameron Anthony. Both boys have part of my husbands name as their middle names, Anthony Stephen. The main problem is we both come from large families and avoiding names that our siblings and cousins have used is getting to be hard. Our last name is Tanner and we have been avoiding names that end with an "er" because they usually dont flow well. We finally decided we like the name Greyson, but when I asked my mom about it she doesn't want me to use it because my cousin's 13 year old daughter's name is Gracen. I personally only see this cousin a few times a year and don't see the big deal. She is a obviously a girl and is much older, plus the names aren't exactly the same. We have also said we may call him Grey. ( Zack, Cam and Grey) She says it will be confusing for her and her sisters because they are very close and will always have to clarify who's "Greyson" they are referring to. What do you think, should I not use this name? Middle names are a whole other issue. No family names left that we like that aren't already used by our siblings also as middle names. For instance, we like Thomas. It was my husband's father's name and also has meaning because we were married in St. Thomas, but our nephew's middle name is Thomas. Noone calls him Thomas, does this matter? Please help us with your opinion on these names and maybe any suggestions of similar names.

I think that when it is difficult enough already to find a non-duplicating name that both parents love and agree on, a slight inconvenience to another family member doesn't need to be taken into account. Even picturing my very own dear mother (because it is so easy to imagine making Confident Declarations to other people's imagined mothers, but not so easy when it is a real mother), I can picture saying kindly, "Yes, it might be a little confusing once in awhile, but it'll be okay." Chances are that context alone will clarify things for them: "Gracen is driving me crazy: the door-slamming, the pickiness about clothes, the hours in the bathroom..." is not likely to cause confusion about which child is being described, nor is "Greyson is teething and up all hours of the night." In fact, which sister is talking will go a long way to clarify which child is being referred to. And, you've found an excellent and easy solution for her in any case: she can refer to him as Grey when talking with her siblings. But even if it were a constant confusion (two boys named Greyson born a month apart, for example), or even if she doesn't want to call him Grey, it STILL seems to minor an issue to be a deal-breaker: surely they would quickly develop a habit of clarifying it: "M's Greyson" and "L's Gracen," for example.

The only downside of the name to me is that both the first name and the surname evoke colors. Do you like the name Mason instead? Cason? Dawson? Harrison? Hudson? Jackson? Bryson? Anderson? Carson? Dayton? Lawson? Grady? Logan? Griffin? Gavin? Liam?

If you like the name Thomas for a middle name and you have two good reasons to use it, I don't see a single reason why it matters that your nephew has the same middle name. It won't even cause the minor confusion your mother worries about with the first name. Even if your nephew's FIRST name were Thomas, I'd still say there was no reason not to use it as a middle name. In large families, the occasional duplication is normal and expected, and certainly not worth choosing names you don't even like just to avoid it---particularly in the middle name slot.

Name Update!

2011-10-09T16:48:00.001-05:00

Update on Baby Boy Oliver, Hazen, Luca?!
Update on Baby Naming Issue: Can a Fourth Initial Save the Other Three?!

Baby Boy Julienelle, Brother to Gwen Grace

2011-10-09T04:14:00.005-05:00

Christy writes:

Swistle I’ve been following you for a while, and knew if I were having a boy I would need your help....so here I am 8 1/2 months pregnant with a BOY and still no name!!!! To make matters worse...My husbands #1 name is a popular girls names: Peyton...HELP!!!!

Our last name sounds like Julien-elle. We have a daughter Gwen Grace (yes just Gwen, its not short for anything). We are absolutely obsessed with her name and love that we don’t know any other Gwen’s.

So we have never really had a boys name (thank goodness we had a girl first!) and I am having a hard time thinking of a name that fits well with Gwen. Like mentioned above, our daughter is just Gwen......I am a “Christine” who has never gone by that one day of my life (always been a Christy)....so I tend to be drawn toward shorter names that aren’t shortened to a nickname. We do have middle name options (woohoo!): James, Paul, or Gideon.

Names I like:

Vance - my secret favorite, my husband liked it at first but is slowly getting over it, thinking it is too “out there”. I really think Vance goes well with Gwen. (but is VJ bad initials to have?!?!?)

Rhett - Husband thinks it sounds like Rex ( and we know a baby Rex)

Paxton - my attempt to sway him from Peyton, I like the nickname Pax (yes I realize this goes against my rule above!) but feel like its a bit made up to me and getting popular.

Gavin - I’m pretty sure Gwen Stefani ruined this one out for us......although I think its a super cute sibling set!!! Plus we are fans, so that might be a little too weird!

Landon - but I don’t think it goes with Gwen

Miles - ehh

Layne - Hubby not into it

Names husband likes:

Peyton - enough said!........Although in my husbands defense, I too liked that name for a boy about 10 year ago....but in this age of mommy groups, gym classes and the internet I’ve come across LOTS of baby girl Peytons.

Barron - bad association

Caleb - this is slowly moving its way up his list......I must admit I do like it, but have a real issue with its spot on the SSA list #33 (although I do not know any kids named Caleb, and honestly have never met one in my life!!! thats saying a lot....see below)

One last thing that complicates things all my friends have boys, so we have lots of boy names off limits: Nathan, Eli, Jack, Will, Kaiden, Liam, Cooper, Luke, Brody, Brayden, Christian, Charlie, Cade, Colin, James, Rex just to name a few.......

Please help me find Gwen’s brothers name! THANK YOU!!!!

I suggest Grant. It's short, it's similar to Rhett and Vance and Landon. If you wanted to continue the G theme (especially if this is your last child), you could use Gideon as the middle name. Grant Gideon Julienelle; Gwen Grace and Grant Gideon.

Or Garrett: it's the Rhett sound you like, but with an additional sound to avoid the Rex problem. Garrett Julienelle; Gwen and Garrett.

Or Clark: Clark Julienelle; Gwen and Clark.

More suggestions for the Julienelles?

Name update! Christy writes:

Introducing Vance Paul Julienelle born November 22, 2011.

I had known in my heart that his name was always Vance, and while my husband liked it was not his #1. After much research of the name Vance in history and lots of praying, we had been given so many Vance "signs" that the name was undeniably meant to be! Even my husband agreed! The name is perfect for him and we get lots of complaints. Thank you for all your comments and support!!

Name Update!

2011-10-08T12:33:00.000-05:00

Update on Baby Girl Pereversoff, Sister to Katie Jane Violet!

Danish Baby Name Dilemma

2011-10-08T07:43:00.004-05:00

Kathy writes:

I'm due in late November with a boy, who will be our second son (no more children planned after this). I am American and my husband is Danish -- born and raised for the first 30 years of his life in and around Copenhagen, moved here and ended up staying. So our main naming issue is ensuring that names work in both languages. Our son is Christian Kai (Christian after his paternal great-grandfather and Kai is another Danish name -- Kaj would have been the Danish spelling but we didn't want him to spend his life explaining the pronunciation in non-Scandinavian countries).

We are having a hard time this time around for some reason. We had a major scare at 16 weeks when we were told the baby had a greater than 1 in 3 of having a serious chromosomal abnormality, and when amnio thankfully revealed he is perfectly healthy, I decided that his middle name should be the Scandinavian variant of Matthew -- Mathias. Husband agrees and likes that name. (It is pronounced "Ma-TEE-as" in Danish.)

As for the first name, DH likes Anders, which is the Scandinavian variant of Andrew. I like it but don't LOVE it. My main concern is that it is just slightly unusual enough in the U.S. that he'll always have to spell/explain it, unlike his brother Christian. I feel like Mathias wouldn't be the greatest first name either, for the same reason -- it's just far enough out there to cause confusion.

Other names that I prefer but that DH doesn't like (primarily because they are "too common" or "too boring" according to him, keeping in mind that his frame of reference is Denmark):
Soren
Henrik
Lucas
Carsten (fair enough -- probably too close to Christian)

Names he likes but I have axed:
Marcus
Andreas
Magnus
Mikkel

I also really like the name Owen and did try to convince him to stray from the Danish list a bit but he won't budge. When we look at lists of Danish names, many of them are just so....Viking-like. And that's not what we're looking for.

So -- just looking for reactions to the name Anders Mathias, as that seems to be our front-runner and I am trying to convince myself that it will work, despite not being my own first choice. Do American readers think it's a little affected or weird? And what if we went with Mathias as the first name -- would that work at all or just doom the boy to a lifetime of confused looks and misspellings?

Thanks! (And Tak, from my husband)

I think Anders Mathias is perfect. Anders has a slightly exotic international sound, without being so exotic that people will have a hard time with it: it's pronounced as it's spelled, and it feels familiar because of the names Andrew and Anderson. Christian and Anders are a great sibling set, and I think Mathias is a perfect middle name. Hans Christian Anderson came to mind after a few minutes, but it's a positive association, and not a very strong one when it's Anders not Anderson.

I think Mathias would also work well as a first name. I've encountered it before on an actual child; to me it seems like a freshened version of Matthew to go along with Elias and Phineas. The spellings Mathias and Matthias combined had a popularity in the U.S. of #463 in 2010; Anders is at #936, but Anderson at #312 makes it feel a little more popular. I don't think either name would have enough spelling/pronunciation/confusion issues to need to cross it off the list. There would likely be the mild hassle of "one T or two" or the like---but most names have something like this. (My name isn't so much Kristen as it is "Kristen: K, r, i, s, t, E, n.")

Name update! Kathy writes:

Anders Mathias arrived on November 20th -- the name fits him well and we've received a lot of positive feedback from people upon hearing it. Thanks again to you and your readers for helping with this big decision!

Name Update!

2011-10-08T06:41:00.001-05:00

Update on Baby Boy or Girl Klein!

Baby Naming Issue: Can Ella Work as a Middle Name?

2011-10-07T08:57:00.005-05:00

Linnea writes:

Is there any name that sounds good with "Ella" as a middle name?

This is our first baby, due early April, and we're breaking all the rules, because we know what we want as middle names, but can't decide on firsts if it's a girl. Our last name is Welch, and having an unusual name myself, I want something that's not completely common for our baby. I'm not against Top 100 names, but generally shy away from Top 10. Celtic & old-fashioned names seem to go over well with both my husband & I. My middle name (Ellen) is the same as my mother's, but I don't necessarily want to give that name to a baby girl. Ella is another family name, of great-grandmother & aunts on both sides, but every baby name we like seems to sound strange with Ella as a middle. It seems like all the names I like end in "a" or "n" and then the names either sound too matchy or run together. Top first name contenders: Fiona (don't like the repeated "a" sound, also makes the initials FEW), Quinn (Quinn Ella sounds like something you might catch from raw fish, same for Corinne, another favorite), Jocelyn (JEW? I don't know that I can do that), Rhiannon (it just seems to run on & on like a stutter) and Avalon (I don't know... is the Toyota connection too much? Will I have to name her brother Camry?). My husband isn't keen on Ella as a first name, but I like Ella Corinne. Is Eleanor too long for a middle name? It seems to solve the "double a" problem and the "sounds like a disease" problem. It's not a family name, but it's close to both Ellen & Ella.

For me, Eleanor isn't too long as a middle name. But I do tend to like long names: I love names like Penelope Elizabeth or Elizabeth Genevieve, and those are seven to eight syllables before even getting to the surname.

One thing I think is working against you is your surname: Ella and Welch share enough sounds that they can run together a bit, or even turn into something that sounds like text-speak: "LOLch!" There seem to be three camps on this issue. Camp 1 says: "Who cares? No one ever says the whole name anyway. And even if they did, who cares what it sounds like?" Camp 2 says: "The whole name should flow well in each combination: first and middle, first and middle and last, first and last. If it doesn't flow, it goes." Camp 3 is the rest of us: we like the name to flow well, but we'll give up some flow for the sake of names we love, or for names that are significant to us and important to us to use. This is where you are now: figuring out how much you want to bend the middle name to make it fit and yet still be an honor name, and how much you want to bend the first name to make a place for the middle name.

And I think you're right: Ella is proving to be a difficult name to put in the middle name slot. I sat here, jaw loosened in concentration, trying to think of a first name it would work with---and finally opened up the baby name book and just started going through trying names one after another. Bianca Ella? No. Blanche Ella? No. Bonnie Ella? Better, but still no. Brooke Ella? Mayyyybe. Chloe Ella? No. Because of the name's popularity as an ending for other names (Isabella, Annabella, etc.) and for medical stuff (varicella, rubella, salmonella, etc.), I think it just attaches itself to the first name and makes either an odd mash-up or, as you've found, a disease.

I like the idea of using Ellen. I like that it ties you and your mother and your daughter together, and also I just think it's a really pretty name. Problem: as you've noticed, it's not too awesome with n-ending first names. Eleanor works better, but is a step away from family significance.

Well, how about this. How about choose the first name first, and then see which goes best with it: Ella, Ellen, or Eleanor? It sounds like you're only KIND OF decided on the middle name and that there's still some flexibility there.

Or, is there another family name you could mash with Ella? For example, if your mother-in-law's middle name were Jane, you could do Fiona Ellajane Welch. It's not my favorite way to do things, but it can be a good way out of a pinch.

In the meantime, can anyone think of any first names that work with Ella as the middle name?

Name Update!

2011-10-07T05:08:00.002-05:00

Update (and photo!) on Middle Name Challenge: Evangeline ____!

May I Direct Your Attention

2011-10-06T08:30:00.002-05:00

I have a post up today on Nameberry. The book Beyond Jennifer & Jason (since updated as Beyond Jennifer & Jason, Madison & Montana and then Beyond Ava & Aiden) took the head right off my shoulders in the 1990s when I was still naming cats but was looking forward to naming babies. All I'd ever seen before then were baby name dictionaries: lists of names, sometimes with meanings and/or origins and/or pronunciations. But this new book had CATEGORIES. It discussed the way names come across to other people, and which other names came across that same way if that's what you were looking for. It was the first time I realized that names get popular in packs, that it's possible to see those packs coming.

I still have my old copy with pencil circlings: Elizabeth, Julia, Louise, Simon, Kyle, Molly, Eliza, Rosemary, Milo, Gus, Leo, Eve, Henry. Names I might not have noticed in the old 1970 baby name dictionary (my mom's, with HER pencil circlings!) I'd used to name my dolls.

Now the authors run the huge baby name site Nameberry, and I'd love it if you clicked through and read my post there: The Case for the Common Name.

Name to Consider: Drewan

2011-10-04T08:00:00.007-05:00

It started as joking around on Twitter. We were discussing how Arwen had used an anagram of a name in a blog post so that people could still figure out the real name but it wouldn't be Googleable (though she stumped us all with Cessia: she had to tell us to switch the E and the A). Then everyone started doing it with their kids' names, to be funny. Then Maureen referred to her husband Andrew as Drewan, and I said: "You do realize that Drewan is a GENIUS CREATION of a name. Like, a VIABLE creation. I think this is a Name to Consider post."

There. I think that brings you up to date on how this came about.

The good things about Drewan:

1. It fits right into the popular -en sound category (Devan, Logan, Mason, Braden, Cameron, Evan, Greyson, Ethan, Nathan).

2. It sounds similar to Owen and Rowan (and of course similar to Drew and Andrew), which I think is very helpful when launching a new name: sounding like established names helps a name to Sound Like A Real Name.

3. It's a solution for people who want the name Drew for a nickname, but want a non-Andrew longer version for the given name.

The possible downsides:

1. Is it a girl name or a boy name? When I consider it each way, it seems a little too girlish for a boy name and a little too boyish for a girl name (spelling it Drewyn would make it look more girlish). But I call this a possible downside because that's the sort of thing a lot of people are looking for: a sensitive/gentle boy name, a not-obviously-a-girl girl name.

2. It makes me think of Druids, and it rhymes with the word "ruin." Again, I put this as a possible downside because many names sound like other words or rhyme with other words, but we stop noticing this when they stop being sounds and start being established names. Isabel sounds like "is a bell"; Violet sounds like violent; John rhymes with con; Lee rhymes with pee; etc.: they're definitely things to consider, but they aren't necessarily name-breakers.

********

What do you think of Drewan? Does it have name potential? Remember that when we consider these names, it's not just a matter of whether we like the name ourselves (though of course we want to discuss that TOO, because it's FUN), or about whether we approve of invented or highly unusual names: it's about whether, considering we know people have all different tastes in names, we think a name has NAME POTENTIAL. Does it...sound like a name? And what do we think are the upsides and downsides of it as a name?

Baby Naming Issue: Politely Using the Same Baby Name Someone Else Used

2011-10-03T05:51:00.002-05:00

Erin writes:

I am now 16 weeks pregnant, due in mId March. My husband and I tried for about 2 years undergoing fertility testing and 3 IUI's. We ultimately had our happy ending when we got pregnant naturally between our 3rd IUI and beginning our first round of IVF.

During the time that we were trying we watched our friends and family conceive naturally and easily and have their babies. Our very close friends got pregnant with twins the year before we finally conceived. They were boys named Ayden and Noah. They have an older child named Chloe that my husband and I watched while they were in the hospital having the twins. We are now the Godparents of Ayden.

Here's the tricky part - my husband and I picked out the names Adin Kennedy (Conant) and Madelin Hope (Conant) YEARS ago...and by that I mean close to 2 years before we started trying. The significance of the boy name is that the village we live in was founded by a man named Adin and my husband loves the Kennedy's. We are not shy about the names we have picked, but don't open up conversations with it. It was heartbreaking for us that one of the twins was named Ayden. However, we are going to plug forward and still use the name.

My question ultimately is: How do we politely deal with using the same name (even though it's different spelling) as our Godson and is it really that big of a deal? They will be a year apart. I find out in a few weeks if it is a boy or a girl, but feel very strongly that it is a boy.

This is a very interesting question: we often discuss here whether a name can be reused in a particular situation, but it's a different matter to discuss how exactly to pull it off in a polite way that eases the situation for everyone---especially when we know there are people who feel that names are one-time-use items, and that any second use of a name constitutes stealing.

In your particular case, it helps considerably that the name is a common one. If both children were to be named, say, Deegan, I suspect there'd be more room for hard feelings. Aiden/Aidan/Ayden/Aaden/Aden/Ayden is, when spellings are combined, significantly more common than the #1 most common name in the United States, and it would be hard to imagine someone feeling as if it were their own unreusable idea.

It further helps that you're choosing a different spelling, and that both the name and the spelling have special significance for you. And it further helps that you've had this name picked out for a long time.

Do you see how I am gathering up reassurances, and yet still nervously skirting the actual practical application of them? It's one thing for me to be certain that it is fine for you to use the name Adin; it is another thing to think of how to encourage your friends to share that certainty.

Because you are close friends, I suspect that the topic of your pregnancy will be a common one. They'll ask how you're feeling, whether you've felt the baby kick, etc. At some point, the discussion will almost certainly turn to baby names. This is when, if I were in your shoes, I would be prepared to let them know. The exact wording will depend on your own speaking style and on the way you usually talk to your friends, but the essence, I think, would be:

Them: "So, have you guys thought about names?"
You guys: "Oh, we chose names back before we even started trying: Madelin Hope for a girl, and Adin Kennedy for a boy."

This is where you look carefully for reactions. Their faces will do one expression when you say Madelin, and there may be a sudden change or flicker when you say Adin. They may be feeling the same heartbreak you felt when they used the name, so what is needed here is SPIN. I suggest filling this moment with propaganda: what a happy surprise it was for you when your dear godson had the name you loved so much; how your love for your godson has only improved your love for the chosen name; how fun you think it will be to have "the Aidans" growing up together. This would also be a good time to discuss how you chose the name Adin, and how you'll be spelling it. The tone throughout should be happy and excited: finally you get to tell them the secret name and the wonderful coincidence, and isn't this FUN!

After that, how things go will depend on their reaction. Some people keep their feelings to themselves and soldier through it with pretend delight. Some people feel the actual delight. Some people speak frankly of a negative reaction. Some people have to process the information before they can react, and may bring it up again later. All this is why I started with the reassurances: I believe you are doing the right thing by using the name you chose. There could nevertheless be consequences to the decision that may be difficult to deal with. We will hope for the best ones: that your friends will be pleased, and/or that they will realize that it is just fine for you to be using the same name. Or that you will have a girl!

Baby Boy Right-with-a-W

2011-10-01T06:20:00.002-05:00

Megan writes:

We're expecting our first child, a baby boy on March 6. That leaves me plenty of time, I know- but I am so torn on names. Our last name sounds like Right with a W. My husband's name is Alexander (Alex) and my name is Megan. My all time favorite name for a boy was hands down Elliot. I wanted to use Jackson for a middle name since this is the grandfather's name. However, our very close friends are naming their son Elliot and we see them on a weekly basis. So my question is, can you help with finding a name that is like Elliot? I also love Everett, Ezra, Elias (I know, all E names) and Oliver. With our last name, I'm finding the R sound a little strong. Oliver Wright doesn't bother me too much- I just love that name. I do hope to someday have a daughter down the road, which I'd love to name Evelyn (Grandmother name). I also like the name Claire for a girl. Not sure if this helps to give a feel for my naming style- but if you could HELP, that would be great!! I read your blog daily looking for new possibilities. Thanks!

and

I know I've already emailed you already- but as I've thought more and more about the names, my husband and I have come to a new favorite: Ellis. We love this name, and it was actually used in my family a lot in the 1800's. I loved that the name had a little history to it. My main concern is, does Ellis sound too similar to Alex? Will it be too confusing to have an Ellis and Alex in the same household? I have started calling him Ellis in my head- but I don't want to commit to the name unless I know for sure. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks :)

Elliot on my own list of names that got away. I recently encountered the name in Henry's class, where it passed the good-impressions test with flying colors. Sigh. Perhaps we will one day have grandsons with the name! Or is there any hope your good friends would find it sweet and funny to both have sons named Elliot? It helps if this has been your first choice all along and you can say "Oh!!! What a coincidence!! That's the same name WE'VE picked out for a boy!!"

Ellis is a good alternative, especially since you have it in your family tree. I said both Ellis and Alex out loud several times, and while I see what you mean about the similar sounds, I still think they're not too confusing to use together.

Ellis is rising in popularity for girls as well as for boys, but boys are still significantly ahead: in 2010, there were 149 new baby girls and 311 new baby boys named Ellis. I am a little worried that it will gain momentum for girls and then be used less for boys, but it is so hard to predict such things. Here's how it's been going so far:

2002: 39F, 177M
2003: 54F, 210M
2004: 47F, 212M
2005: 85F, 246M
2006: 100F, 267M
2007: 111F, 262M
2008: 110F, 274M
2009: 124F, 327M
2010: 149F, 311M

Inconclusive at this stage of the game, I'd say, but it's risen from 1 female Ellis per 4.5 males to 1 female Ellis per 2 males. In some cases, names do remain used for both boys and girls; in other cases, once the girls move in, the boys move out. The popularity of the girl's name Ella may sway this one toward the girls---or, as with Kyle and Kylie, Ellis and Ella might coexist: one used mostly but not exclusively for boys, and the other used only for girls.

A similar sounding name (though unfortunately without the family connection) is Louis.

A name that has the rhythm of Elliot and the style of Ezra is Gideon.

A name I think of as being in a group with Elliot and Everett is Emmett.

Names I think of as hanging around with Elliot and Oliver: Simon, Julian, Sebastian, Frederick.

Or I wonder if you'd like Malcolm Right.

Another possible E name is Edmund. Edmund Right.

Baby Girl Herrason, Sister to Ava Gabrielle

2011-09-30T05:16:00.004-05:00

Kelly writes:

My 2nd daughter is due October 28th. My first daughter's name is Ava Gabrielle Herrason. We chose Ava Gabrielle by putting my favorite name & my husband's favorite name together. I just loved the name Ava, & Gabrielle is my husband's cousin. Of course that is not really the best way to pick a name for a person. In the end, I am not sure how well "Ava Gabrielle" actually flows. I had a bit of regret about her name as I realized 1. what it means to have a Top 5 popular name (knew the name was popular, but wasn't prepared for the disappointment when another cute little girl has my daughter's name) and 2. that Ava Gabrielle doesn't actually flow as well as I thought.

For our second daughter, I am pretty much set on the first name of Charlotte. I am hoping you agree that Charlotte goes well with Ava. I think it also goes well with our last name, Herrason (simply by the way it sounds & also because Charlotte & Herrason are both english names..). I really love that Charlotte is a classic, romantic sounding name. Another reason we like the name Charlotte is because we just moved to Louisiana from Asheville, North Carolina, which is about 2 hours outside of Charlotte. So, the name Charlotte is also special as that is where she was conceived (or the general area). I understand that Charlotte is becoming more popular, but no where near as popular as Ava. I have decided I will be ok with a top 100 name (although I probably would not again pick a top 5 name!)

As for a middle name, I have fallen in love with the name Charlotte Claire, but (as with Ava Gabrielle) mostly because Charlotte & Claire both ended up being finalist names for me. I am worried that I am possibly putting together two of my favorite names versus really picking the perfect middle name to go with Charlotte. Although, another reason I like Charlotte Claire, is that my husband & I may possibly call her CeCe/CC. I was pretty set on Charlotte Claire, but then last night I woke up worrying... Picking a name for a person is a stressful job! & I just want to do it right! So, I guess I am e-mailing you to see what you think of the middle name Claire with Charlotte. I Think it flows well, but is that just because I am in love with the name? Does it look ok to have the middle name start with the same letter as the first name?

Just to also let you know other considerations - I thought of Claire as a first name but realized there are a few too many Claires in my extended family & also, the name is Very popular in my area (almost to the point that it is boring..). I had a pretty long list with my first girl & kinda worked from there with this one. Another middle name I like is Anne as it is my middle name. But in the end, I just don't love it as much as I love Claire. I also love Grace as a middle name... But I know a celebrity recently named her daughter Charlotte Grace & I would hate to completely take that name.

Also, -if I have a boy in the future, my top names are Grant, Jack & Bennett. That could change, But I do think Charlotte somewhat goes with those names. Also, I know it is important for the whole family to have names that sound "good" together... well my husband's name is Jeff/Jeffrey, & I am Kelly. Perhaps Charlotte isn't totally fitting with the more Irish Kelly, but I think it does work with Jeff/Jeffrey.

At this point, I am pretty set on Charlotte as the first name, but would consider suggestions. hmm but did I mention, I have been calling her Charlotte & have already started ordering things with the name Charlotte on them? :) I possibly just want some reassurance LOL! Even if you don't end up posting my "story", I would Love a response from you!! Also, my first daughter was 2 weeks early and I suspect this one may also be early, so any suggestions after mid-October will be useless.

It sounds to me as if you're set on both parts of the name, and that this is just last-minute doubts. I think Charlotte Claire is great, and that Charlotte goes great with Ava and with Herrason.

Name update! Kelly writes:

Charlotte Claire arrived on October 19th at 11:18pm weighing 6lbs 8.2oz & measuring 19.25 inches. Her birth was amazingly beautiful & peaceful. We are so in love with our sweet baby girl Charlotte! I am So happy with the name we gave her. The name seems to fit her perfectly! We all mostly call her Charlotte, but we love the option to call her CC . Our family & friends love the name also! Thank you for posting about us. I loved reading all the positive feedback!

Middle Name Challenge: Annabelle ____, and a Poll to See if Leigh Works

2011-09-29T08:10:00.005-05:00

Jennifer writes:

Hello Swistle and readers! I am Jennifer, my husband is Kyle, and we are expecting our first child in March 2012. We do not plan to find out the sex. I have a question that I would LOVE to see as a poll! We are weird and have already chosen baby names for all possible children! We don't think we will have more than three total, so we have three boy names and three girls names! The boy names were easy- first would be Samuel Gene (we both love Samuel, and Gene is my hubby and FIL's middle name), second Wesley Jon (my grandpa's middle name and dad's first name), and third Issac Wade (love both the names). You can see there is a two-syllable/one-syllable pattern, which we love!
Girls were a little harder. Our SECOND girl name is Emmeline Claire, and third is Philippa Kate. We just adore these, and love the similar three syllable/one syllable theme.
Here is my question! Our first choice girl's name (which my hubby is in love with and I love but am not quiiiite sold on) is Annabelle Leigh. Some of you may already know the problem- "Annabel Lee" is a poem by Edgar Allan Poe in which the main character, Annabel Lee, DIES. So...is this a deal-breaker? Several people I've spoken to have made the connection immediately, and I am unsure if giving my possible daughter the accidental namesake of a dead EAP character is terrible! We can't find another middle name that we LOVE with Annabelle, though Jane is a possible contender. Please help! I would love to see poll numbers and general thoughts on this! Also, if you have a (very preferably one-syllable) middle suggestion, please let me know.
THANK YOU!!!
P.S. Our last name is German and phonetically sounds like HERkit.

I would not have made the connection, but I also haven't read much Poe. I think I read The Tell-Tale Heart in high school and that was it. Oh, and I watched the episode of The Simpsons that spoofs the poem about the raven. So it is not exactly surprising that it wouldn't ring a bell for me, and I think you're right that what's needed here is a poll. Let's have one over to the right. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Even if the poll comes back with a high recognition factor, I think it might be okay---unless you plan to call her regularly by first and middle. The different spellings help, and it also helps that Lee/Leigh is such a common middle name.

But I think I might change the middle name regardless, because of the way the L ending of Annabelle merges with the L beginning of Leigh. I like Annabelle Jane a lot. Or Annabelle Kate, if you want to gamble on not having three girls. Other possibilities:

Annabelle Eve
Annabelle Faith
Annabelle Grey
Annabelle Jean
Annabelle Jo
Annabelle Joy
Annabelle June
Annabelle Lou
Annabelle May
Annabelle Paige
Annabelle Quinn
Annabelle Reese
Annabelle Rose
Annabelle Ruth
Annabelle Sue
Annabelle Tess

Baby Naming Issue: A Name Similiar to the Name of a Lost Baby

2011-09-26T07:11:00.010-05:00

Michelle writes:

Good morning. I have a bit of a baby name conundrum and could really use some help. We are trying to come up with a baby girl name and have a name that we love, but there is a problem. We love the name Claire Elizabeth Welter (whatever first name we choose, the middle name will be Elizabeth. It is my middle name, it was my great grandmothers name, it was my great, great grandmothers middle name, etc. My grandmother always expressed an interest in passing this name down. I love it, so I would like to do that). My husband and I both love the name Claire. This should be an easy decision. However, my sister-in-law lost a baby to Trisomy 18 about 3 years ago at 26 weeks. They named their baby girl Blair Elizabeth. My husband is worried that Blair and Claire are too similar, especially since the middle names would be the same. The more I thought about it, the more I agree with him. However, a number of people that I have talked to didn’t seem to think that it was a big deal. My question is, should we even continue to consider this name, or should we move on to other names? We do have a short list of other possibilities (Ellie, Amelia, Charlotte, and Lyla) but both just love Claire so much. We have a two year old son named Jack Ryan already, so our only real criteria beyond the middle name is that we do not want the name to start with a J. Thoughts?

Thanks so much!

My opinion is that it's too close, but let's have a poll over to the right to get a group opinion. [Poll closed; see results below.] At first I thought it might be okay (it's been several years; it's not exactly the same name), but as soon as I imagined being a family member hearing the name of the new baby, I flinched hard. If it were just the first name I would already be hesitating, but the one-two punch of first and middle seems too painful---and unfortunate for your daughter, too, to have her name so evocative of a family tragedy.

I think it can be very hard to move on and choose another name after something like this. The natural inclination is to compare each new option to the unusable name and find it wanting, instead of choosing which usable option is the favorite. One mental trick I've found helpful is thinking of other situations that would render the name unusable. For example, in your situation I might think "If our surname were O'Hare, we wouldn't be able to use Claire" or "If my husband's first wife's name were Claire, we wouldn't be able to use it" or "If my husband hated the name Claire, we wouldn't be able to use it." I'm not sure why this works for me, but I think it's because it reminds me that there are many reasons names can be ruled out, and that we all have our own groups of such names.

Perhaps if you have another daughter later, you could use Claire as her middle name (it's what I'd be suggesting for this daughter if the name Elizabeth weren't already set). Or perhaps a name like Clarissa would work: it has much of the sound of Claire, but I no longer get a strong flinch from Clarissa Elizabeth.

Or do you like Cecily, Celeste, Cora, or Corinne? Or Abigail?

Or Rose. Rose Welter; Rose Elizabeth Welter; Jack and Rose. I love that. I like the repeating Z sound, and Rose has the sweet simplicity of Claire. [A commenter points out that Jack and Rose are characters in a movie. I wonder if Hope would work? Hope Elizabeth Welter; Jack and Hope.]

Or Eve. Eve Elizabeth Welter; Jack and Eve.

Or Lucy. Lucy Elizabeth Welter; Jack and Lucy.

Or Grace. Grace Elizabeth Welter; Jack and Grace.

Baby Girl Francis, Sister to Edward Russell

2011-09-25T07:56:00.004-05:00

Stephanie writes:

Hi Swistle! I am a long-time reader (both blogs!), only part-time commenter, I'm afraid. I am hoping you can lend some advice on our current naming pickle.

So, the basics: my name is Stephanie and my husband is Taylor, our last name is Francis. We have a 2 year old son named Edward Russell--he was named before we even got married because of the immediate need to cure my husband of his thoughts of getting a junior. :) Edward is my husband's first name,my father-in-law's name (he goes by Eddie), and his father's name. My FIL is a junior, but I wanted to kiss my MIL every time we went through the first boy naming thoughts that she didn't make my husband a third--Taylor is his mother's maiden name (and quite useful as a name to go by, since his father was already Eddie). Our son's middle name is my father's name (and his father's name) so it's a neat, round about 4th generational thing for both names. Our son goes by Edward because I liked Ward and my husband liked Ed and neither of us could stand the other's choice, so Edward it is. When we "need" a nickname, we go with E.

I'm currently 15 weeks (I KNOW, plenty of time!) and we just found out that this one is a girl which has thrown me for many a loop, one of which being that I loved our boy name. LOVED it. It was Nathaniel Jack--Nathaniel is a name that my husband and I have loved for a long time, one of those rare finds where we both like the full name and the nickname, Nate, and it also happens to have been my husband's grandfather's name. Jack is my maternal grandfather's name and my maternal uncle's name, and also we both like that name very much. It would have made my mother very happy to have her side honored (she's sensitive to that sort of thing). Oh well, maybe next time!

Anyway, now we know it's a girl and now we have a slight naming predicament. I have always thought my first daughter would get my middle name, Katherine, which was passed down from my mom (she was named after both of her grandmothers). (You can tell, we are really big into family names around here.)

For first names for a girl, I want to honor a close friend's mother who passed away several years ago. This is actually my husband's best friend's mom, with whom I worked after college and she really just had a big impact on my personally and professionally. So her name was Caroline and we are planning to ask our friend for permission to use the name for our daughter--we are fairly confident he will say yes. I had always thought Caroline Katherine, but a few weeks ago I started un-warming to that combination.

Now that we are having "real" discussions about this, my husband reveals that he just really does not like the name Caroline itself. He doesn't like that it doesn't have any easy or good nicknames (he also doesn't like it because it's too close to our alma mater's rival university--Carolina--which is, yes, a pretty petty reason, though I do understand his point). Also, I'm really unsettled on Katherine as a middle name if Caroline is the first name. It just doesn't flow to me anymore.

So if we use Caroline as a first name, do you have any nickname suggestions and middle name suggestions? There are ZERO family names we would want as a middle name. His family has really terrible female names (think Hilda Pearl and the like) and there's just nothing we both like on my side. My paternal grandma's name is Ruth and I thought that was pretty, but a) he doesn't really like Ruth, b) my sister has already "claimed" it (and I don't feel strongly enough to fight over it) and c) my mom would be upset if my dad's side got honored again before/over hers. (Seriously, this is a true issue. I know. Trust me. But it it is.)

On the slim chance that our friend tells us he would prefer we didn't use Caroline, our backup name is Rebekah (nn Bekah). My husband LOVES it. LOVES. IT. I like it very much, and his love for that name is so strong that I do not have a desire to push back against it since I also like the name very much. I am not crazy about that spelling, but my husband STRONGLY prefers (he REALLY LOVES THIS NAME) this spelling to the more common Rebecca. My biggest contention with the spelling is just that it's NOT the most common and so it's likely she would have to correct people frequently. However, it's certainly an ACCEPTED spelling and doesn't look made up, so I'm okay with it. Again, he feels so strongly about it, I don't feel compelled to fight this battle.

If we used Rebekah, I do think Katherine goes well/okay with it. I'm happier with that flow than Caroline Katherine.

The other possibility that I thought of yesterday is the compromise Rebekah Caroline. I actually think that is prettier than Rebekah Katherine. Anyway, my concerns/issues--both pro and con--for this "compromise" name are: 1. I do so love the name Caroline itself. I think it's beautiful. 2. It would pretty much give both my husband and me what we want, although him moreso--I really want to honor Caroline and he loves (have I mentioned that he LOVES THAT NAME? It's kind of weird, actually.) the name Rebekah. 3. My mom. As mentioned, she is sensitive. I worry that she will be upset/get offended if I don't use Katherine or some other family name from her side. 4. I don't want to "shove" Caroline to the middle name--is that "honoring" enough? I don't know if that question makes sense, but hopefully you know what I mean. 5. On the other hand, if we use Caroline as the middle name, that does give a little more room to our friends to also use that name either as first or middle (to clarify: I don't know that they want to at all).

Anyway, this is a very long question now with lots of extra information and questions along the way. Nicknames/middle names for Caroline? What do you think about Rebekah Katherine versus Rebekah Caroline? What do you think about just skipping Caroline as a first name and doing the "compromise name"?

My husband just deployed for 6 months (so he will not be here for the birth! Hurray!) (That was a sarcastic "hurray" lest you or anyone think I am ACTUALLY excited about my husband missing the birth of our first daughter.) so we are at a little disadvantage in that we can't say the names aloud to each other and such, but we are both very much "get it sorted out" people which is why we want to get this name settled rather early on. So we can move on to more important things like surviving the next 6 months. :)

Thanks so much for your consideration and help!

Is it important that Katherine be the middle name, or could it instead be the first name? It goes so beautifully with Edward, and has such nice nickname possibilities. Then Caroline could go in the middle name slot, which is a nice place for a name that has significance but one of the parents doesn't like it enough to use it as a first name. Katherine Caroline Francis.

If Katherine should be in the middle name slot, though, then I would drop the name of the husband's best friend's mother LONG before I would drop the name that came down through your family. There are other ways to honor important people in our lives, so although you greatly respected your former co-worker, I don't think it's as crucial that you show it with your daughter's name.

Or perhaps just not with THIS daughter's name: another possibility is to save Caroline for a possible future daughter's middle name. The middle name slot is still considered a large honor, and in fact in many situations I think it works better. This idea does mean risking it not being used at all, since you might not have a second daughter---but it's my favorite option here, because I think the struggle to use the name Caroline is the main issue tangling up this current child's name.

So where are we? We have eliminated Caroline as a first name because your husband doesn't like it (unless nicknames such as Caro, Cary, and Cara would change his mind), which also relieves us of the task of finding middle names other than Katherine to go with it. And I'm strongly advocating against giving up the long-standing family name in favor of the friend's mother / co-worker name, which means we don't need to find first names to go with the middle name Caroline. This leaves us with ______ Katherine Francis.

I think Rebekah Katherine is wonderful (I love the repeating K), and meets all the preferences. It uses a family name from your mother's side; it uses part of your name you've always thought you'd use for your first daughter; it uses a first name you both like; it's wonderful with Edward Russell. And it gives you something to look forward to with the next child either way: if it's a boy, you can use Nathaniel; if it's a girl, you can use the middle name Caroline (or perhaps by then your husband will have warmed to it: Edward, Rebekah, and Caroline is a wonderful sibling group).

Baby Naming Issue: Could Hildegard Work as a Middle Name?

2011-09-24T07:22:00.005-05:00

C. writes:

I feel somewhat premature in sending this as I am not due until April, and we won't even have a shot at knowing gender until thanksgiving, but we plan on having several children, so it's bound to come up eventually, and I'm feeling surprisingly settled about everything save this last sticking point, which I have made no progress on for months.

My grandmother's name is Hildegard. She is an amazing woman, and ever since my now husband met her, we have joked about naming children after her. Sometime around when we began trying to conceive he made the comment that he was '100% absolutely in favor' of using the name Hildegard.

And I became unsure. It is just so very much of a name. It is so very unapologetically German.

To put it in perspective, our last name is 'Ford'. We would probably pair it with the first name Alice, possible nn Liss/Lissy. Potential sibling names / other names we like include Hazel, Lynn, Nell, Ada, Liam, Tobin and Daniel. The only other Germanic name we've even remotely considered is Clara, and it isn't a huge favorite. Other family names we would consider as honor names for siblings include David, Robert, Jean, Grace and Minona. I look at those lists, and think that while they could use some combinatorial tweaking, they are pretty consistent and a good starting point. But none of them sound anything at all like Hildegard.

On the other hand, all by itself, I like the contrast and rhythm of 'Alice Hildegard Ford' - it's just when compared with potential sibling names that it seems so out of place.

Finally, we live in a fairly rural area, and I somewhat doubt that our children will be exposed to many other international sounding names amongst their schoolmates. This is pretty low on the list of concerns, but I suppose it's still on there.

Neither of us like the concept of multiple middle names, and I do not like Hilde at all, so we're in an all or nothing situation.

Am I worrying too much? Should I just say 'pah, it's an honor name, she can use an initial if she doesn't like it' or is that a lot of Germanic syllables to thunk down on one child alone?

Thank you! I've had a ton of fun reading your blog.

p.s. We think it's very important to ask the honoree in question, as my husband was named after a relative who later admitted to hating his name, but we don't want to ask if we're going to change our minds and not use it, which might account for my eagerness to have it settled.

I would myself say "Pah." I can even see it being fun as an adult to have a very unusual middle name. A similar name in my own family tree is Willemina, and I'm imagining someone saying idly, "What's your middle name?"---and me being able to say "Willemina" instead of "Nicole." THAT would wake them up a bit!

I see what you mean about it not coordinating with other possible honor names, but I think it would seem silly to give up on the idea of honoring someone you and the other parent very much want to honor, and instead honor someone else, just because in a group of siblings the middle names wouldn't coordinate. I'm pretty far up on the spectrum of liking first names to coordinate in sibling groups, and even I don't care much if the middle names coordinate. It's NICE if they do, just because of the pleasing tidiness, but it's not any kind of deal-breaker---and the coordination of them all being honor names is already pleasingly tidy.

Baby Girl Pereversoff, Sister to Katie Jane Violet

2011-09-22T08:53:00.003-05:00

Lisa writes:

We really need help naming our soon to arrive baby girl. I'm 2 weeks 4 days away from D-day and my husband and I cannot agree on one single name. We already have a two year old named Katie Jane Violet - Jane after my Mom and Violet after my husbands Mom, so this go around is all about what we like best since we've honored our Mom's. As such, I think we're just having a really hard time with the lack of rules.

Here is our small, small list of maybes:
Isabella
Quinn
Bella

My husbands last name is Pereversoff, so the shorter the first name, the better. I love a middle name of Jude (all time favorite music is the Beatles) - but then the initials BJ are a little mockable. The biggest hurdle is that I'd love an Ella, but my cousin already has a daughter named Ella. That brought me to loving the name Anabella, but one of my Grandma's names is Anna, so would I need the middle name to be Ruth after my other Grandma to not offend? And then where would it end, cause the husband wants his Grandma's name - Dora in the mix. And since I already think for this one we should do whatever we like best, that's just an argument I'd rather avoid.

If we pick Quinn, I'm not sure Jude goes that well with it.

I think I just need more options. I'm hoping you can help to find us something that we both love!?

Thank you!

Do you think your cousin would be okay with another Ella? Ella Jude Quinn would be a nice complement to Katie Jane Violet. Or would Ellie be a little better? Ellie Jude Quinn Pereversoff.

Or perhaps it would be better to put Ella in the middle name slot, just to be sure: ____ Ella Jude might be pretty, or ______ Quinn Ella.

I see you like Isabella, and I'm wondering if you'd like Isadora. Downside: it's long, and so much more formal/uncommon a name than Katie. Upside: it honors your husband's grandma without provoking the dah-dah-dah-dah-dah-DORA song, and Izzy and Dorrie would both be sweet with Katie. Isadora Anna Ruth. I know you didn't want to go down this path, though, so this is more just playing around with possible honor name combinations for fun. (Ooo, or Annie would be so sweet with Katie. Annie Jude Isadora Pereversoff; Katie and Annie. That's one grandma from each side. ...Okay, I'll stop now.)

I don't think that the name Annabella would force you to start honoring all the other grandmothers. If I were in that situation, I think I might be tempted to declare merrily to everyone that no, it was just a coincidence that it had the "anna" in it as MANY girl names do---and then I'd whisper privately to my Grandma Anna that it WAS after her but I didn't want to be stuck honoring ALL the grandmas SHHHHH don't tell! The biggest downside of Annabella is it's such a long name. Annabel takes off a syllable, but it sounds like it's the -ella that appeals to you.

Do you like Lila? It has some sounds in common with Ella, and it's short. Lila Jude Quinn Pereversoff; Katie and Lila.

Or Lily. Lily Jude Quinn Pereversoff; Katie and Lily.

Even better: Lucy. It coordinates well with Katie in both style and formality; it's a Beatles reference; it's short. Lucy Ella Quinn Pereversoff; Katie and Lucy.

Or Abby, which has all the upsides of Lucy except the Beatles reference (unless Abbey Road counts?). Abby Jude Ella Pereversoff; Katie and Abby.

Or Molly, another maybe-Beatles reference. Molly Jude Ella Pereversoff; Katie and Molly.

Or Josie. Josie Ella Quinn Pereversoff; Katie and Josie.

Sophie. Sophie Jude Ella Pereversoff; Katie and Sophie.

Grace. Grace Ella Jude Pereversoff; Katie and Gracie.

Laney. Laney Jude Pereversoff; Katie and Laney.

Elsa might be enough different to not step on any cousin toes, but similar enough for you to like it. Elsa Jude Pereversoff; Katie and Elsie.

Same with Emma. Emma Jude Pereversoff; Katie and Emma.

I know very cute sisters named Katie and Emily. Emily Jude Pereversoff; Katie and Emily.

Name update! Lisa writes:

Thought I'd send you an update to a blog response you posted for me. We've just had our baby girl (yesterday morning) and we named her Quinn Ellie Jude Pereversoff - Katie and Quinn. Thanks so much for your help!

Name Update!

2011-09-22T08:20:00.000-05:00

Update on Baby Naming Issue: Looking for a Boy Name From a Folk Song!

Baby Boy Wall-Ridges, Brother to Harriet Lucille and Matilda Corinne

2011-09-21T10:05:00.011-05:00

Bethany writes:

Hi! My name is Bethany. My wife's name is Kathryn. We generally go by Beth and Kate although by our full names as well. Our last name is hyphenated and rhymes with Wall-Ridges.

We have identical twin daughters, Harriet Lucille and Matilda Corinne. They are known to everyone else as Harriet and Matilda but at home we often call them Hattie and Mattie, because we are evil. They are 4 and so far do not object but I'm sure they will!

We are due to have a son in very early November. He will be the only one in our house with a penis for the foreseeable future. Even our dogs are female and this almost certainly our last child. So we want his name to be strong but not overpowering, if that makes sense. Our girls names are of course pretty old fashioned and classic names with kicky nicknames. Since he will almost certainly be the only boy in our family we want his name to feel special without singeling him out. I hope this makes sense!

Our girls are named, in assorted ways, after our mothers (Kate's mum's first name is Corinne, my mum's middle is Lucille). So we'd like to cover our dads with the boy. Happily they both have Edward somewhere in their names so that will be our sons middle (i see its your sons name as well!)
but for first names we are a bit...stuck.
Here's our shortlist. Please let us know what you think!

hers:
James
Henry (but we are not repeating initials, how else are we going to label anything?)
Phillip but i hate Phil
Frederick but I hate Fred/Freddy
Andrew but hate Andy (see a pattern here?)
note that Kate doesn't hate these nicknames but she doesnt like them either.

mine:
Owen
Seymour out of left field but like it
Oliver
Caspian totally doesn't fit with our girls but I LOVE)

thank you!

I think Caspian might fit very well with the girls' names. I agree it sort of SHOULDN'T fit well, and yet I'm finding it DOES for me: Harriet, Matilda, and Caspian. Oh, I think I know what it is: I think it's that for me, all three are book names. (Harriet from Harriet the Spy and Harriet You'll Drive Me Wild; Matilda from the Roald Dahl book; Caspian from Narnia.)

Atticus gives me that same feeling. Harriet, Matilda, and Atticus.

It's too bad about Henry---I do love that name. I wonder if you'd like a name I think of as belonging to the upcoming batch of similar names: George. George Edward Wall-Ridges; Harriet, Matilda, and George. Georgie or Geordy are both very cute nicknames.

I also love James from your lists. Harriet, Matilda, and James. Really, really nice.

Do you like Simon? Harriet, Matilda, and Simon.

Or Ian, one of my own top favorites. Harriet, Matilda, and Ian.

Or Felix? I think it's got a lot of the quirky charm of the girls' names. Harriet, Matilda, and Felix.

Same with Arlo, which has been on my love list ever since Arlo's Theme Song.

Or Charlie is also adorable but a little less uncommon: Harriet, Matilda, and Charlie.

Ooo, how about Wesley? Harriet, Matilda, and Wesley. I really like that, and I love the nickname Wes.

Or Ezra: Harriet, Matilda, and Ezra.

I think my favorites are George, Ian, and Wesley.

Name update! Bethany writes:

Thank you so much for using our question!
we loved reading all of the answers/comments especially yours. We got a TON of ideas and in fact we did not decide for sure until he was two days old. we went to the hospital with Felix, George, Caspian, Quinlan and Wesley. We thought Wesley was most likely, but then our little guy was born and we brought Mattie and Hattie to see him, and we asked them to tiebreak between Quinlan and Caspian (he just didnt look ike a Wesley). They started calling him Q! So his name is
Quinlan Edward. we LOVE it, love that he's our 5th, love that we can just call him Little Q and Baby Q, and we are so happy. thanks again for all the help!

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